The refugee crisis

[Fantozzi 4,067]

2 hours ago, Activate said:

They are the catalyst to change.

From 340 000 refugees coming to germany during the Balkan wars today 20.000 still living in germany. In fact most of them returned home after the war and helped building up the country. Another great part emmigrated to US after they had become skilled workers in germany.

It's another interesting fact that refugees being young people and beeing educated and studing in the country of arrival - many years later have an impact on economy by building up trade connections and one of the reasons why germany economical is so strong and has such a high export rate. Having been an immigration country in the 60ies of last century for many europeans from Spain and Italy pays back today f.e. with german products and knowledge much valued in those countries.

Heidelberg, my home town is a good example. The medical faculty of the university with several highly specialized hospitals and transplantation centers etc. attracts students from all around the world and they get known to german health care products as well. So you may travel around the world and in the farest corner you may find physicians that studied in Heidelberg and they speak german.

On refugees a keyrole is the education the arrival country can offer. What you invest in the education of 'foreign people' - even teaching the language - mostly pays back on the countries economy. It's just that you invest in developments that show up results 20 or 30 years later. 

Countries with bad education systems most likely will have problems with refugees and most likely people themselves not having profit from education will have problems with refugees. 

One has to see 'integration' isn't limited on national borders. By educating people from Syria and Iran and Afghanistan not now, but in 20, 30 years will endow relationship on a cultural level. That's what ISIS hates most. That we seed our culture around the world by educating people, that we offer education. That's what they can't stand.

Shure, our countries, our education system, can hold only a certain amount of refugees. But the idear to take as much as it can hold, is a good one. To refuse any refugees is a bad idear - it's a bad deal on global economies. All those immigration countries - being it for a long time (not today but since WWII, like US and Germany and Sweden) they grow economically much faster than those countries that have very closed borders. And I bet - we will see this in 10, 20 years - China's economy will get serious problems as studies already show: foreign people don't like to work or study there and therefore cultural impact on the rest of the world stays low and therefore knowledge transfer remains limited and they have to pay much money to buy knowledge. Knowledge is an important ressource.

Now you say - there coming so many poor uneducated people. Well me I was uneducated to. Education isn't a big issue - ignorance is the issue. Young people to lazy to get understanding, eating fast food and feeling depressed all the time. Dealing drugs instead of reading books. Deadheads may be a problem. But most of those refugees are highly motivated - it's a pleasure to teach them as they are curious and interested and try to understand everything. They are hungry. Regarding education they are best raw material you can get.

60 percent of all the nursing staff in german hospitals are foreigners. If germany closed its borders there would be nobody to care for the old and the ill. The health care system simply would break. It would be a complete chaos. Because they don't stay forever - they come and go.

Most of the discussion is so far from reality. Maybe US is different. Maybe Poland is different. But Germany being a successfull nation in great parts is dependend on people not being germans. on migration movements.

Statistics tells - most of them won't stay. They go and others come. And you looking only on those who are coming, so you get frightened. Instead Angel Merkel knows they are an important part of the welfare state. She knows in a few years they all will pay pension scheme. But most of them will get only a miminal or no pension as they will leave again. They are a good deal for the country. 

 

[LexusInfernus 908]

9 hours ago, Activate said:

Taking in refugees is not the answer. Those making the journey to better countries are the educated and wealthy citizens of the country.

So what of the poor? Are they left to suffer because they can't afford the escape? These countries are only going to get worse as their skilled tradesmen and educated people flee. And those stuck in the hellholes are going to be further impoverished.

People who say 'we are bettering our own countries' with the intake of skilled migrants are frankly selfish. They don't see the bigger picture. The people who are leaving should stay in their own countries to help rebuild. They are the catalyst to change. The reason why so many countries never seem to escape the third world status is because anyone who has a brain packs up their stuff and leaves.

Yes and no. 

Refugees (as defined by UN conventions) are fleeing violence, war or prosecution. To say that they should stay because they are the better off and better educated segment of society and therefor the only ones capable making something of their country is incorrect. When a war rages in your home country or you run the risk of imprisonment, torture and execution because of who you are, you can't really expect these people to make a positive difference. Perhaps when the war is over or they are no longer prosecuted, then yes. But until then, its stupid to tell these refugees that they should return home and make that place better. 

Economic migrants, people who try to go to Europe because they want a better job or make more money, and not because of the situation in their home country is life threatening, well they are perhaps better off staying at home. Brain drain is a serious problem in their case. Then again, these people are not recognized as refugees and they are usually told to return home. Problem is then that its pretty difficult to send people home, as their home country often refuses to take these people back in. 

[Toby66 155]

Politicians can´t be trusted, enough said. I usually talk too much so here is where i show restraint and composure so i won´t talk too much and in politics it´s always talk talk talk and nothing happens.

Sweden needs to have a more realistic and working immigration policy.

I will actually DO something instead and go and make myself a cup of coffee and a couple of sandwiches, then the bed.

And...

Lets be nice to each other, every day. If doing that on a personal level it´s enough, i don´t feel like talking. 

(Here it now itches in me to go on and on and on and i could be talking the talk, politics, if i want to). Poly-tics = many bloodsuckers.

Be Good

 

  Edited October 25, 2019 by Toby66  
I had to put in something to not be off topic.