Belgian BAT-thread

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

@sgt Pepper: That way it won't look real, the lowrise doesn't have that green copper on it's roof. But I'm working on the L-shaped building, that building has a glass roof. Maybe the roof of the lowrise will look less flat with the other building behind it...

Update soon

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Here it is... the L-shaped roof looks like ****

I think I made the edges of the glass windows on the roof too thick:

Does anybody has a close-up picture or an example in SC4 of a glass roof-window (I don't know the english name)?

[T Wrecks 10,209]

I think you mean a skylight.

Oh, and to answer an older question: You can make rooftops look less flat if you make them darker around all edges, outlines and corners.

If the roof is horizontal, you should also make sure that there is no "directional" pattern on it. With "directional" I mean stripes / streaks / lines / gradients from one side to another. Such effects are typical of angled and vertical surfaces. Take a wall, for example: It might be brightest towards the top, where most light reaches it, and darker towards the bottom. The bottom end may be stained with dirt, too. Likewise, rain water running down the wall may have left vertical stripes. If you put such a texture on a horizontal roof, it will look awkward. Patterns on a horizontal roof should not show this scheme. The roof texture you are currently using on that side building is not ideal in that respect.

All in all, you are making good progress, and the building does look much more realistic and soundly proportioned with the flat annex. Keep up the good work!

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

A skylight yes, thank you... Maybe the edges are too bright? I've made them a bit darker (the ones on the right, the left skylights are the same as before).

The roof isn't completely horizontal (unlike the roof of the tower): there is a small gradient going down to the street-side (probably to avoid becoming a pool after a rainy day). That's why I've used that texture: the darker part should look like the water ran down of it. I've turned it around on this picture (the darker part at the highest point).

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

I finished the buildings... added windows and even added the ugly red curtains

Now to adjust the details and adding the nightlight...

So bring it on guys!

North View:

South View:

East View:

[Jasoncw 11,840]

I'm sorry to come so late with bad news, but it looks like the lowrise part of the building is very off. 

It looked off to me, so I went to google earth and measured the building's footprint, and then figured out the building's basic massing, and below is more or less the correct massing of the building:

Luckily the tower is fine, other than needing to be a little taller, but the lowrise part will need some work. 

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

@JasonCW: I know that the scale is off... I did that on purpose to keep the lot smaller (now it's 8 tiles long, with the correct size it would be almost 12 tiles). So I decided to make an adjusted lowrise.

I've had some previous problems with the height of the tower but I've got some help with that... I'll raise it a few meters and see what comes out

Thanks... I'll work on it after the weekend

[SimHoTToDDy 2,938]

Yes but if you just go resizing things they will look out of proportion with each other.

By the way, I measured loosely 98m, which is just over 6 SC4 tiles, not even close to 8 let alone 12. 1 tile is 16m.

I say scale it properly.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Oh right... I changed my grid settings to 10m... It's now 5 x 2 tiles... So I can resize the entire building

shouldn't be too much work, I can probably re-use some elements

[SimFox 801]

your grid is irrelevant; I would strongly suggest you to turn it off altogether. It's just confusing you. Forcing to model by grid rather than by size.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

I've made the tower a bit taller (that was the easy part )...

I've redone the lowrise on the street-side (with 12 windows, the sidewindows are even wide as the space between the windows etc...) and the L-shaped building has been made longer as well...

The entire structure is now 98 meters long (just over 6 tiles)...

I know it still needs some work, but I hope that I've got the size right?

Here is the new picture in draft:

[Jasoncw 11,840]

The part of the building to the far right should be the same width as the tower.

The entire low rise portion should be deeper.  It should be about twice as deep as the tower.  Also, I don't think there's a courtyard there.  It looks like it might be an atrium, but there appears to be large skylights where you have a courtyard.

All I did to make my massing, was measure the building using the measure tool in google earth, and then I used photographs to estimate how tall certain parts were compared to how wide they were.  So I'd just go into google earth and start measuring things to see how it compares with how you modeled things.

Here is the building on google maps and bing.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

I've done the mesuring again with google:

Each red line is 20 meters. I'll use these as a reference for refitting the lowrise...

Jason, you're right about the courtyard... There seems to be a roof with the same skylights as the L-shaped building but I'm wondering what that glass-like thing is (see yellow ?). Is it a flat skylight like a porch or is it some rooftexture (like the buildings on the left)?

The same goes for the black ?... It isn't showing on any pictures, so I think it's a lower building with a roof...

I think I'll have to break in tonight and go have a look

Edit: I also changed the curtains... they were too red. They now have the right color...

[SimFox 801]

May be these will help:

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Oh... these are great!!! How did you get these?

Thanks... this will help a lot!

I see that I have a lot of work to do as well...

-the skylights are wrong

-the roof of the square building has two levels

-the roof of the lowrise has an edge and the texture is more plain

-there is a small skylight on the roof of the lowrise

-the roof over the door needs to be longer

better get started...

[SimFox 801]

these are from Bing Maps so called Bird's Eye view

[fabricio83tst 27]

So nice Alex now i say to you and believe me i'd like to use your wall yellow texture in my industrial BAT, or something almost like this could you help me?

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

@Simfox: they are great... A new world opens up for me...

@fabricio83tst: No problem I'm glad to help, I'll send it to you in a PM

[zero7 68]

If your building is in a city that's covered by both Google and Bing, using Google Earth's satellite and street view and the Bing 'Bird's Eye' view you can get so much information about a building for a reproduction. Hopefully, the 'Birds Eye' view will be the key to you getting the look of the lower building right.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Here is an update on my booktower:

- the new skylights are on the roofs (I even counted the amount of glasses in them )

- The overhang on the towers are now black (as on the photo) with the diagonal X-shape on them

Next on the "do to list":

- the walls of the L-shaped lowrise need new windows (small square ones), one under every skylight

- the edge around the roof of the lowrise

- the roof of the square building at the right

[SimFox 801]

What you are still missing and hat, incidentally, makes your roof look "flat" (it's ironic cause it suppose to be flat) is that lack or parapet walls - that little bit of wall that extends above the level of the roof.

Also your roof texture is a huge overkill. The pattern, it's size, its clearness are all killing the feel. They make this building look unreal, like a miniature. Besides there is No logic what so ever for those patterns on it. It just screams - I was the first busy thing that caught the eye of an author.

I would like to quote Mies van der Rohe - "Less is MORE"

From the point of modeling. The biggest issue right now is that windows of the "second floor" of the look bit of the building. Yours are virtually sitting on the roof, while in the real thing they have a space under them that is about 125%-130% of they own hight, incidentally same as the height of the wall above them.

Also those windows in your model start virtualy of the tower. While in the real thing there is a blind stretch of the wall equal to about the width of the window.

PS you also have a little repeating white thingie on the texture on the tower itself. It's not terrible obtrusive, still... may be you can get rig of it altogether - it is the main thing that suggest that it is tiling up.

But all in all it is a very good first BAT. You're clearly learning. And what is most important understand that you have to learn and work, rather than find excuses like many beginner baters do.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Here's the update:

What's new?

- roof texture + an edge on the roof (not big enough so it seems --> I'll change that)

- wall on street side (there is now a space between the tower and the windows)

- rooftop of square building

- wall on L-shaped building (small square windows at second floor)

- white thingie (Simfox ) on tower texture is now gone

On the list:

- the entrance

- space between windows and roof

For comparison: I've put the old and the latest version nex to each other

 

[SimFox 801]

It is on the right track! But why do you reduce size of your pictures - to almost the point one had hard time seeing what is what! Let alone judge any proportions and some such.

Here are couple of more points tha0,t kind of, jump at me:

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

@ simfox: sometimes I read in forums that a moderator removed a picture because it was too large, so I didn't know how large a picture can be... I'll make them larger from now on (is 600 width OK?)...

I've already noticed that the L-shaped building was out of place when I was adding the flat skylight to the roof in between the buildings (it didn't fit )... So that is already done

Tomorrow on my list:

- rebuild the wall on the rear side of the L-shaped building (the one you can't see)

- rebuild the wall on the right side of the L-shaped building (no curtains there, just little windows)

- flat skylight on roof

- little skylight on roof lowrise (street side)

- some details (drainage-pipes on walls, some stuff on the roof of the tower, etc)

- thinner overhang on the tower

Did I forgot anything?

[Jasoncw 11,840]

As long as your images aren't HUGE the BAT moderators will probably not notice or care.

Almost everyone keeps their images a reasonable size, and I've only ever had, maybe 10 images resized (I don't know how many the other BAT moderators have had). So as long as you're being respectful of other people's browsing experience, I wouldn't worry about it.

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

Here's the update:

the red arrows indicate the changes:

-thinner black overhangs

-the glass in the tower is lighter and poles are added to the inside of it (for the nightlight later)

-the L-shaped building has been moved and the roof in between has a skylight (see pic below)

-new walls at the back and side of the L-shaped building

-little skylight on roof lowrise

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

I've done some experimenting with nightlights as well...

Here is my first attempt with the booktower:

It wasn't easy with the limited nightlights of GMAX but I'm pretty satisfied with the result

Here is a close-up:

The walltexture (wood panels) isn't showing and the sidewindows aren't lit up, so I'll have to work on that

As comparison: here is a picture of the real tower with nightlight:

[Ke|is 3,333]

WOW, great job in this BAT. I like the ilumination.

[T Wrecks 10,209]

Good job so far, it really resembles the original!

Originally posted by: Alex_Bervoets

The walltexture (wood panels) isn't showing and the sidewindows aren't lit up, so I'll have to work on that

quote>

This sounds like one and the same problem to me: The light shines only on the floor, not on the walls. The windows themselves aren't "lit up" anyway. They are simple glass. A window only appears to be "lit up" when you can see something illuminated through it. Since the walls aren't illuminated, and since you can only see the walls through the side windows, these windows appear to be "dark", although this impression of brightness/darkness is not a property of the window itself, strictly speaking.

(I hope this is SimFox-approved, or I'm in for a lecture. )

[Alex_Bervoets 91]

@ TWrecks: I've had a few conversations with Simfox and Jasoncw about the nightlight and Jason suggested to use spots pointing down... That's probably why the floor is lit up and the top (sidewindows) not... I'm going to try and illuminate the concrete "floor" behind it without removing the shadows of the pillars...

Update soon