Bat4Max 2K edition V 4.5

[SimFox 804]

I see...
 

Well, you problems are produced by the way game functions. I think it is good to know some basics because the solution to the problem may be GPU dependent and you would have to experiment a bit. For this to be a guided process, rather than chaotic clicking on anything you can get you mouse over, you need some basic knowledge.
 

So, let’s start.

Game doesn’t have any real illumination in its core engine. Illumination as in ray tracing. It doesn’t use even older and “faster” model of shadow maps. Instead it fakes the later. It takes 90 rotation of the current view model, feels it with specified “shadow color” and overlays it on top of the games terrain. This overlay uses (I believe) multiply blending mode (if you familiar with Photoshop you should know what it is). Anywho, that’s the way “shadows” are produced.
 

To lay off graphic processing from the CPU game delegates all that trouble to GPU. Yet GPU is a machine and can do only what it is told to do. And here comes important part – how those command made. There are 2 ways (I must warn that following is a speculation, or educated guess – if we have here people who are intimately familiar with game design may be they could correct me if I’m wrong)

1. normally graphics work in this way – program declares what it want’ to get – say particular blending, scaling etc… These “wishes are picked up by OS and transferred to the drivers of the graphic card.
2. drivers specifically designed to work with particular GPU turn those requests into series of explicit algorithms optimized for given GPU.
3. functions are performed.

However, in case of games driven by desire to save all the time and CPU cycles needed for performance some of these steps are normally eliminated. Instead, games or games engines have their own set of drivers that interpret all games request into form optimized for the GPU. Saving in steps in this implementation are obvious – this is why games normally run in Full Screen mode. Game engine takes full control of your GPU.
 

All rosy except the fact that as time passes GPUs change. Their manufactures update drivers to accommodate for those changes. However, in case of games, game engine is rarely updated past couple of years since game release (if updated ever at all). So, after a while, it goes out of sync with current GPUs. It’s also could be the case that new drivers can perform same functions way better and faster on current hardware than old set included in game engine.
 

All this leads to the basic premise that today it could be better choice to run old game like SimCity4 in windowed mode rather than in Full Screen mode. In this case first model is implemented – everything goes from the game to Windows and them to drivers. Yet computers have become so fast that couple of extra steps this mode requires are either unnoticeable or even overcompensated by the advantages of using way better optimized drivers.
 

In case of SimCity4 on modern system Window Mode results in noticeably better graphics (particularly dithering – creating/faking missing colors for transitions), true 32 bit blending (in Full Screen you’ll only get 16 bit blending –which results in stair stepping effect on slight gradients – noticeable in say water in game). Effects, however, may differ somewhat depending on your GPU family (nVidia, or ATI/AMD). And, on top of it all, game runs noticeable faster and smoother (this may be GPU dependent the most).
 

Since most of the dithering will occur at night and particularly Dark Night, as the given color and brightness range is most limited at this view, it is exactly Dark Nite mode that will benefit in Windowed Mode the most.
 

So, basic recommendation is to play your game in Windowed mode. All the info was to give you understanding (at least my version of it) of the process, so that you may tune/adjust your particular setup.
 

Apart from these general considerations there are some particulars about Night View and especially Darker Nite. Given how shadows are generated and particularly applied in game (for instance that they are mixed with lights – which is physically incorrect and impossible) and the fact that very night view is archived by simply overlaying solid color layer on top of everything else (again on top of lights – dimming and coloring them as well)  and blended in I would suggest that it is better to run game in night view with no shadows at all. At any rate they are largely redundant and even contradictory in Dark Nite mode anyway.
 

So, how to get rid of them? Well this, again, may be GPU specific process. But here are some basics how it works on nVidia GPUs.
 

First off all Game doesn’t have No Shadow setting. Instead it offers 3 shadow quality settings:  Low, Medium and High. Selecting one of them from the graphic setting panel inside city view will not really give you final result until you save the game. If you do same in regional view once you enter the city you’ll immediately have the final look.
 

So, back to our problem. Choosing Low settings on nVidia GPU disables shadows all together and gives you optimal look for Darker Nite. For day mode I could only recommend High settings, cause Medium produces ugly and misplaced blobs of a shadow.

And here are few illustrations. First Day View (all are in windowed mode):

High Shadow after Save:


Medium Shadow after save:


Low Shadow before save:


Low Shadow after save (no shadows):




and Night views:

Hight Shadow after save:



Medium shadows after save:


Low shadows before save:


Low shadows after save (no shadows):

 

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Is there any way to insert a (new) night view into a .sc4model without re-exporting the day scene? I want to make some dark night versions to my buildings, however some of my scenes do not look the same now ( in max 2010) as they did in 2008 when I first exported them (so no, I don't have the old output files either). I really don't want to re-tune all of my materials to export a building that was finished a long time ago.

I might have figured this out on my own eventually, but my time is short these days. I would assume exporting the night scene in/on the old model file and inserting it with the day-to-night buttons, but I remember messing that up a while back when I tried it. Anyway, thanks.

[SimFox 804]

Yep, absolutely!

You would first need to delete all the night FSHs from SC4Model File. This, as far as I know, is a manual process. However it is a very easy couple of mouse click operation.

1. Open your model in iLive Reader.

2. Arrange the file first by Instance, and then by Entry.

3. Select all FSHs that have "8" as a fifth digit in their Instance ID

4. Right Mouse click and select "Remove File"

5. Save SC4Model file.

This removes all the night FSHs from your model. Now you can use it to export new night view.

[Odainsaker 2,137]

Cool to hear!

I had also at one point just tried to insert a new set of DarkNite FSHs into a model already containing MaxisNite FSHs, figuring that the new DarkNite ones would just overwrite the previous MaxisNite ones. It clearly did not work out that way, for while the model file "seemed" to work, it was also around 50% larger in filesize. Should have figured it would keep the older FSHs.

I'm growing the habit of making of copies of model files with inserted day FSHs, but no night FSHs, just so that they can be worked on cleanly for both MaxisNite and DarkNite. Good to know now that should I ever botch the job, or also tinker with older stuff, there is a clearly defined method. Thanks muchly!

Now to finish restoring the clunker machine and get its graphics card functioning and monitor cooperating.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Ah, I was guessing it was something along those lines! Thanks for saving the day again Simfox You might get your dark night Pripiat blocks after all!

[SimFox 804]

Here is a source of FREE and LEGAL latest versions of 3dsMax as well as other Autodesk software for students:

http://students.autodesk.com/

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Last time I used the student download section, they only had 30 day trials for 3dsmax. Now it looks like you can get a 13 month license for free (6 month for 2010). Hellova opportunity.

[Francis90b 748]

Yep, and i could benefit from it.Good idea to post it here, SimFox.I'm sure it could be useful for many people out there.

[Shadow Assassin 336]

Hey, just downloaded 3dsmax 2011.

I followed the install instructions, and it seems that a couple of things are missing from my install...

Even though all the rollouts for gamma correction for um, TruNite and all that are correct, they work correctly, but it seems the actual SC4BAT stuff is missing. Also, I get the following errors:

- Night windows are incompatible with your version of Max and are disabled (I presume this error's been around since the days of Max 7 and thus can be ignored?)

- '--No ""not"" function for OK' - I have absolutely no idea what this is all about, and I think it's what's stopping Bat4Max from working properly...

The only rollouts that appear:

- truNite Export

- Let There Be Light

When I try to run the actual export, MaxScript opens and gives me the following error for the following line:

---------------------------

MAXScript Rollout Handler Exception

---------------------------

-- Unable to convert: undefined to type: FileName

---------------------------

OK

---------------------------

quote>

for line 8 of the script.

The paths seem to be relative, so shouldn't it matter whether or not it's installed in the default directory or not?

[SimFox 804]

you have to be precise in your explanations. Because now you have several contradictory statements in your message. First you say that you don't have any of the standard Bat4Max roll-outs, and then later you say "I try to run the actual export". How is that possible? To run export you would need to have "export" roll-out. So do you have it or not?

My best suggestion is to re-install everything, if you will follow instructions precisely everything will work. Don't omit anything, don't change steps order, generally don't do anything except what is in the instructions.

If this will not resolve problem when I would need precise and accurate description of what happens on Max start up, screen shots of the panel with roll-out (preferably all open) and screen shots showing your installation folders (such that both content as well as path could be seen)

[Shadow Assassin 336]

First you say that you don't have any of the standard Bat4Max roll-outs, and then later you say "I try to run the actual export". How is that possible? To run export you would need to have "export" roll-out. So do you have it or not? quote>

I'll clarify: it's the export button in truNite export. Not the other export rollout - that's completely missing.

edit - sorry if I sounded a bit short earlier, but basically, the errors I get are what I said earlier. Beyond that, BAT4MAX does not work. At least the gamma controls and all that work fine... is there any chance at all that I may have downloaded the wrong file?

Oh, one other thing: There wasn't a gamepacks folder in my install copy of 3dsmax 2011 before I copied it over from the .zip archive. Does this mean that I have to add it to the folder paths manually in 3dsmax?

I'm totally new to all this, sorry...

[Shadow Assassin 336]

Okay, disregard my previous post.

It seems my settings for the 3dsmax folder didn't take, so I had to fix it today. It works fine now.

[SimFox 804]

What do you mean "settings for the 3dsmax folder didn't take"? Do you mean UAC? What version of Windows do you run?

[SimFox 804]

Bat4Max update ver 4,6

&

Warmer LetThereBeLight day rig

OK here I have a small, final, update to the current line of Bat4Max. It removes last problems associated with installation of Max into default location e.g. c:\program files\autodesk… (that is apart from UAC issue!), namely the fact that rendered and converted FSH wouldn’t insert into SC4Model file in such configuration. The problem is in the way DATCMD works. It wouldn’t accept quotation marks around both program path (datcmd.exe itself) and the source/destination files. Such situation would work even if you type those manually into command Prompt window.

I managed, however to find workaround for this problem and now it is problem no more! So, assuming that you have resolved UAC problem at installation you’ll have fully functional BAT4Max at Max default location.

 

In addition to this problem another nag that have been with us ever since deltree had been removed/disabled by current versions of Windows – inability to delete output files by single click at the button in Max – has been resolved as well. Clicking on Clear Output Files will now either delete said files or inform you why it can’t proceed – no SC4Model is selected. It is all done without deltree – so it is totally compatible with modern versions of Windows and safe.

 

Additionally “autoexecute” check box had been removed, at least for the time being as it may interfere with truNite export workflow.

 

Another improvement is better, I may say perfect, Alpha generation. Some of the settings inherited all the way from Bat4Max v2 had been interfering with Alpha generation during export resulting sometimes in jugged edges or various shades of grey spots and splotches on alpha. The problem became more apparent once Gamma correction became standard under LetThereBeLight workflow. It has been partially address in last release, but now I can say it has been resolved once and for all.

 

Furthermore, alpha setting had been tuned to ensure that the alpha you see during preview will be the alpha you gonna have in your FSH files after export – this is important issue in generating semitransparent elements in SC4Models.

 

Updated script files could be found here

To install just copy over files in your gamepacks\bat\scripts folder with ones included in this download.

 

Apart from that technical update recommended to all there is one of the more optional nature -new version of LetThereBeLight that generates slightly warmer Sun Lighting. The difference isn’t dramatic and very much point of personal taste. Both versions, older and newer, will overall produce lighting compatible to the game. This update/option is only for users of 3ds Max version 2008 and newer.

 

Warmer LetThereBeLight

To install this update just copy over files in your max\scripts\startup folder with one included in this download.

[SimHoTToDDy 2,939]

Thanks for another round of fixes! If I'm reading this correctly, we should get fewer of the background artifacts around the edges (regardless of whether or not it is being processed)? That's fantastic, always something that got on my nerves.

I might give the warmer ltbl rigs a try too, maybe not till I start a new project though. We'll see.

Thanks again.

[Shadow Assassin 336]

What do you mean "settings for the 3dsmax folder didn't take"? Do you mean UAC? What version of Windows do you run?quote>

Win7 Pro.

It doesn't matter, it's fixed now.

[SimFox 804]

well it does, since that experience could be helpful to others who run in a similar problem.

[art128 4,622]

Hi,

I've got a problem when I try to get a model name, here's a pic that speaks for itself..

Anyone have any idea how to get ride of that ? For the moment I simply can't export any BATs... Too bad I was planning to release some in the next days/week..

[SimFox 804]

It is because the file you're trying to select is NOT in c:\users\Arthur\Documents\SimCity 4\Plugins - exactly as the messages says! It is that simple and that clear. Most likely it is in some subfolder inside of Plugin folder. And that wouldn't work. Your SC4Model HAS to be in Pluging folder.

[art128 4,622]

Yes, but the SC4Model IS in the plugin folder, i forgot to say that before..

[SimFox 804]

well, then you have been messing with BATFORMAX.ini file and you shouldn't have. Max will set up everything just right. Just replace your BATFORMAX.ini with the clean one from download and restart your MAX. Make sure (if you use Vista or W7 and you have installed Max into default location in Program Files folder, that you have full write access to you BAT folder

[Cockatoo 2,257]

Yes, thanks for the updates Simfox!

In addition to this problem another nag that have been with us ever since deltree had been removed/disabled by current versions of Windows - inability to delete output files by single click at the button in Max - has been resolved as well.quote>

Just curious, what was wrong with using deltree? I copied the old deltree.exe from a previous version of BAT4Max (2.1 I think) into my installation folder after you stoped including it in and was successfully using it with Win 7 and BAT4Max 4.5 right up until I saw this update. Was this unsafe? I never had any trouble.

[SimFox 804]

I don't really know what exactly was unsafe - just heard it repeated many times by many. Of course, as you have pointed out it doesn't really mean that this is true.

What version of W7 do you run? I haven't been able to get deltree to work - been getting error messages...

As for teh latest update... well it will need another update soon :-S I have fixed FSH insertion for day export but forgot to update one from truNite ones... I'll correct the code tomorrow and release it..

[Cockatoo 2,257]

What version of W7 do you run? I haven't been able to get deltree to work - been getting error messages... quote>

Windows 7 Home Premium, 32-bit. Never had any issues at all.

[SimFox 804]

well It may be because I've been using x64 bit systems for a while now... Anywho the point is moot now since this new routine don't need deltree at all.

[Heblem 600]

what can i do to do when I get a export code 6 in gmax (exporting LODs), even i did the model in 3dsmax, i cant export a 24x10 model...

[SimFox 804]

Size of the LOD has upper cap limit of 32 256x256 tiles for the biggest zoom (this is a limitation of the naming convention used 2 levels of HEX numbers)

So, you have to stay within this limit. How tall is your model? you may try to make LODs as close to the model as possible cause those 32 tiles are assigned to and only to the space occupied by LOD. So if you have large empty spaces within your LODs get rid of them. It may help. I remember way back I've managed to get LOD allowing export of full sized Burj Dubay as a single piece rather than assembly of 2 or more parts. It is all in just slipping under that limit.

That is a limit imposed by naming. There, however could be other issues as well. The nature of Error Code 6 is such that it is impossible to say precisely what had happened.

PS.

I've done a quick test. If your model is exactly 384x160 m and 16m tall than you will not be able to export it as a single piece:

As you can see you would need 50 256x256 pixel tiles to cover/texture it at zoom5 view. And you are allowed only 32. So it is clear no go. However if you model has some openings that would allow to save some tiles then modified LODs may save the day.

To do quick estimate, just render zoom 5 preview and take it to Photoshop. There go to View -> Show -> Grid. Then in preferences set the grid size to 256 pixels and you will be able quickly count those that cover your model proper. It will also show you where you may scale it just a bit to fit in the allowed 32 tiles.

GMAX Bat was supposed to have a specific warning for this kind of problems. The warning text "this model is just too big" can still be seen in the scripts. But either it has never been made to work or was broken sometimes later. Broken clearly by MAXIS stuff, as it hit the street in this broken state.

I will take a look at it to see may be I can write some sort of tool for MAX taht would do such testing and warn people if models are too large.

[AsianEvolusioner 18]

is that normal when i use let-thereBe-light script, the render time is significantly longer time than without that script?

but im really suprised to know that the result is really awesome!!

ermmm.... how to change the settings if i want to use default Max render setting for fast render>?

I'm new in 3dSMAX

[SimFox 804]

well it all interconnected. Quality you see is determined by those settings turned on by scripts. And choice of renderer is a fist and key one. So, without it you will not have this result. But when you speak of a long time, how long? building doesn't look too big or complicated. What are you comp specs?

I ask this because apart from what the scripts do render time could also be dependent on say material settings of some issues with geometry... this, however, is not too likely though, as, I assume, you used the very basic ones there. They aren't necessarily the fastest ones, but not the longest ones either...

Long story short - you will not be able to use LetTherBeLight without Mental Ray. BTW it is a default renderer for 3dsMax for at least 4 years already (since version 2008). Scanline is there purely for backward compatibility reasons. It hasn't been developed for at least 8 years now, so it is sort of atavism. If you are to get more or less acceptable quality from it it would take many times longer than far superior quality from Mental Ray. So you are in no go area if you want it to look good you can't really go back, because it will not.

If computer upgrade is in the cards, then for best rendering performance you need CPU. The faster and the more cores it has the better. After that memory. Videocards, for now, are irrelevant for rendering performance... That is just info...

[AsianEvolusioner 18]

well it was not that very long, but still longer than usual.

It took couple seconds to render before using the script, and now become almost 30 secs up to 1 minute (for the 2 BATs above) and maybe more if the BATs is more complicated. It is not a big deal for me btw. I just wonder how to change the settings into 3dsmax default if i want to speed render my BAT just want to check how it looks

i use laptop, ASUS K50AB with AMD athlon 64 X2 2.1GHz, 4GB ram, and ATI HD4570 512MB.