Pearl Harbor Day

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

"December 7th, 1941, a day that will live in infamy"  Frankliin Delano Roosevelt.

66 years ago, the world was saved from fascism by the provocation that brought America into the World War for the second time.  Yes, the second time, because there really has been only one world war, with a few years of truce in the 1917-1937 interval.

Let us remember those valiant souls that gave their lives at that time, especially those permanently entombed on the Battleship Arizona.

Whatever you may think of America, it is a sleeping giant that stands for freedom everywhere.

[GreekMan 246]

a sad day indeed!

this day will live in infamy!

The US beat the enemys which was so good!

[belfastuniguy 18]

A very sad event in American history and yes Europeans will always be thankful of the help America give in the last years of the war, it does not go unremembered.

[patriots_1228 51]

We did somthing in school today about this. It looks like you paraphrased the Japanese General up there. Didn't he say "we have awaked a sleeping giant" or somthing?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228 We did somthing in school today about this. It looks like you paraphrased the Japanese General up there. Didn't he say "we have awaked a sleeping giant" or somthing?quote>

Yes, but quoting him exactly wouldn't have been right.  Truth is evident, yes?

Like us Canadians, if you get Americans riled enough, the job will get finished soon.

[Taylor1 0]

Wow like 2400 or 2500 lives lost today 66 years ago, i request all Americans and if other people from other countries would like to join in your welcome to it, it is definitely a sad day in American history.. we will NOT forget those who lost their lives to the japanese bombers.

[Duke87 1,070]

^^^^I seem to remember Peal Harbor being on the order of 1000 or so casualties, not over 2000. But I could be wrong.

...frankly, it's impossible to hold any ill will against the Japanese anymore, given:

-CDs

-Video Games

-Anime

-countless cutting edge electronics

Japan would likely not be anywhere near the tech haven it is today had we not kicked their ass in WWII and thus made them shift all their efforts from military to civilian purposes. Germany may have seen a similar benefit had the commies not sliced it in two...

[Smarty218 2]

^^^^^^^^^^^

How true. I love my psp, ps2, xbox, wii, cell phone, laptops, PDA, gamecube, and gadgets.

Can't live without em'.

The movie Pearl Harbor is highly dramatized and frankly, it sucks.

[LarksTonguesInAspic 28]

My mother woke up that day to her 8th birthday, and the world had changed forever before breakfast. My uncle Earl would soon ship out to the Pacific, where he would see combat at Coral Sea and Guadalcanal. His ship was hit by a kamikaze and the gunner was killed, he jumped on a gun and helped down another before it hit. Amazing the things we think of in association with this day.

[canuck3360 14]

Tora Tora Tora is the most appropriate movie to watch for today

and pause for a moment what a momentus day in history.

[bakercity 270]

66 years ago, the world changed for ever. Japan paid the price of awakening America and her people. May all the sailors and marines that survived the attack,

THANK YOU BIG TIME!!!!!!!!!! I was lucky to been born at Pearl Harbor Naval Base, Hawaii in the shadow of the U.S.S. Arizona (BB-39) Memorial in April of 1983. I am going to watch the movie "Final Countdown" which involves modern U.S.S. Nimitz (CVN 68) traveling back to December 6th-7th, 1941 and returning back to the 1980's.

"" December 7th, 1941, A Date That Will Live In Infamy" President Franklin D. Roosevelt address to joint session of Congress asking Congress to declare war on Empire of Japan - Monday December 8th, 1941 US Capital, Washington, DC USA "". Rest in Peace our honered dead; God Bless You and America. JKB

[BurroDiablo 222]

Originally posted by: Duke87 ^^^^I seem to remember Peal Harbor being on the order of 1000 or so casualties, not over 2000. But I could be wrong.

...frankly, it's impossible to hold any ill will against the Japanese anymore, given:

-CDs

-Video Games

-Anime

-countless cutting edge electronics

Japan would likely not be anywhere near the tech haven it is today had we not kicked their ass in WWII and thus made them shift all their efforts from military to civilian purposes. Germany may have seen a similar benefit had the commies not sliced it in two...quote>

Basically why the US occupied them once they Surrendered, so Communism wouldn't spread to Japan... also the same reason Hirohito wasn't excecuted along with Tojo and the rest, as long as the Emperor was still alive there would be no power struggle.

They did good though... its the least the US could do after Nuking them twice... you showed them the way and now they've surpassed every Nation on Earth as a Technological marvel. The world would be very very different if Communism had spread to Japan.

[patriots_1228 51]

yes...the only difference is, pearl harbor, the attacked our navy. Nukings, we attacked there people. Big difference. Innocent people. There is no excuse for that.

another topic for another day though. These are two different Japans we are talking about. 1940's Japan was our communist enemy, 2000's Japan is our high tech friend.

[BurroDiablo 222]

Japan wasn't Communist during the 40's... remember, the Nazi's hated Commies. Japan was a Monarchy was it not (since the Emperor held most the rule)? And Commies hated Monarchs (hence why Tsar Nicholas II was excecuted during the Russian Revolution)...

[patriots_1228 51]

o...my bad....so complicated...you know what its like in america...if they aint like us they commies just kidding, you know your simtropolis's favorite commie, right el burro? (I should probably stop talking like a drunk right now, im just tired)

[The_Dalai_Llama 15]

Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.

[Taylor1 0]

Originally posted by: The_Dalai_Llama Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.quote>

Yea, look at al-quida after bombing us a few times and stuff, we practically have them out of iraq and exsistance.

[LarksTonguesInAspic 28]

Originally posted by: El Burro Japan wasn't Communist during the 40's... remember, the Nazi's hated Commies. Japan was a Monarchy was it not (since the Emperor held most the rule)? And Commies hated Monarchs (hence why Tsar Nicholas II was excecuted during the Russian Revolution)...

quote>

 

An interesting footnote...Germany was communist for a short period in the early 1920's.

[BurroDiablo 222]

It was a Workers Party but they were Socialist not Communist. They hated the whole 'Anti-Property' thing of Marxism, Hitler was very much in favour of keeping Property... he kept the Communist and Nazi Ideaologies seperate, mainly by instilling massive amounts of Patriotism in the masses and also by killing Slavs and Jews; Slavs because they may in some way support Communism and turn Germany into a Russian puppet, and Jews because he felt they were masterminding a great conspiracy to take over the world (quashing the triumph of Nazism).

Both of these things pretty much made the Nazi ideology linked with Anti-Communism and Racism. Main reason I don't like to call myself a Socialist is because he WAS one... thats why I stick to Communist. Also, none of the other ideologies appeal to me (Marxism, Leninism, Stalinism, Maoism, Trotskyism)... i'm an open minded Revisionist, that why I take any critism of Communism lighty, always quick to correct mistakes and misconceptions though

[Joesocwork 4]

I admire the sacrifices that generation willingly made on behalf of freedom.

[BurroDiablo 222]

Yep, I have great admiration for those who fought in the war, even more for those who died. My Great Grandad (D.1999) fought in the Battle of Britain flying a Hawker Hurricane and then flew sorties over Germany for the rest of the war. I've played many MANY World War 2 games, the scale of some of those conflicts were insane (Stalingrad, Bulge, Operation Overlord), its amazing how people acctually survived to tell the tale, just playing those games makes you feel guilty sometimes, when you die in the game you have to think 'Damn, if I was really fighting in Bocage country right now there'd be no second chances...'

Might be different in real warfare though... being shot at unleashes that will to survive that makes you react very very quickly to the happenings around you... thats what I imagine happens anyway, not acctually been shot at myself.

[Duke87 1,070]

Originally posted by: canuck3360 Tora Tora Tora is the most appropriate movie to watch for today

and pause for a moment what a momentus day in history.quote>

You know, before DVDs and widescreen/letterbox airings existed, people used to joke that it was called "Ora Tora Tor", since that's all you'd see on the screen when the title appeared due to the sides being cut off.

Good movie, though. I haven't seen Pearl Harbor, but since I've heard it's a big holywood drama as opposed to a real based on a true story educational type film, I completely lack interest...

--------------

On a somewhat relevant note, my grandfather fought in World War 2. He was a fighter pilot....in the Italalin air force. Fighting against the allies. The family hadn't immigrated to America yet at the time. Oops.

I know my dad likes to spring this on patients of his (he's a doctor) who are war veterans. While they're telling war stories, he mentions that his father was a fighter pilot in WWII, and gets all kinds of bright eyed responses. "Oh, really? What division was he in?", etc. And then upon hearing he was an Italian their smiles completely vanish and the situation becomes awkward. Fun how that works.

[BurroDiablo 222]

I remember watching a little bit of Pearl Harbour... the Japanese Planes got shot down by a couple of bullets from a [Warhawk?], I don't really know much about planes but I can imagine they were a little more resilient  than that. Anywho, Wiki says the film is historicaly inaccurate... wich is great, because I hate historicaly inacurate film so it gives me a reason to hate the movie even more.

I wouldn't call Pearl Harbour one of my strong WW2 knowledge points to be honest, i've watched documentaries and stuff but the gritty details are best described in writing... reading Wiki made me relize the actual severity of the attack, the USS Arizona was hit by a Japanese 'Armour Piercing Shell', that hit ammuntion below decks and blew the ship from the inside out, killing over 1,000 people (nearly half the death toll). Thats pretty spectacular... I didn't know much about its demise, I just thought it was a random ship they'd decided to make a Memorial out of to commemorate Pearl Harbour.

Originally posted by: Duke87

I know my dad likes to spring this on patients of his (he's a doctor) who are war veterans. While they're telling war stories, he mentions that his father was a fighter pilot in WWII, and gets all kinds of bright eyed responses. "Oh, really? What division was he in?", etc. And then upon hearing he was an Italian their smiles completely vanish and the situation becomes awkward. Fun how that works.quote>

My girlfriend is part Italian... her mother told her once that she could possibly be a direct decendant of Mussolini since her Great Grandmother knew him vaguely and her Grandmother never really had a father...

[patriots_1228 51]

Originally posted by: Taylor1

Originally posted by: The_Dalai_Llama Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.quote>

Yea, look at al-quida after bombing us a few times and stuff, we practically have them out of iraq and exsistance.quote>

 

where have you been getting your information? george bush? if we had driven them out of iraq/existence, our soldiers wouldn't be getting killed so much.

[Odainsaker 2,135]

"Tora Tora Tora" still remains the best of the Pearl Harbor movies. It was also standard fare in Oahu on Saturday matinee television. The more recent flick "Pearl Harbor" really sums up as "the Day Japan Bombed a Hollywood Love-Triangle," with the awkwardly exciting spectacle of American soldiers getting slaughtered in way-too-cool special effects. Better yet, a good book to read, even if it is a little dated now, is John Toland's extensively documented "Rising Sun: The Decline and Fall of the Japanese Empire: 1936-1945," which goes into the all the history and political decision making building up to and including the war as witnessed from the Japanese perspective. One wonders at the logic of telling Hirohito, "we simply don't have enough troops or resources to ever subdue China, therefore, to gain those resources we need to expand the war beyond China by now attacking the United States, Great Britain, and the Netherlands, and perhaps later invade the Soviet Union come spring." Huh?!?!?

My paternal grandfather, whose Filipino parents had immigrated to Hawaii in the 1920s/1930s, used to tell stories of being a teenager walking the agricultural fields on Oahu during the day of the attack, and remembering seeing all the Japanese planes swarming overhead making their way to the various bases. No trip to Pearl Harbor is complete without first a visit to the Arizona Memorial, the wreckage of which is still eerie to look at, followed by a tour within the submarine USS Bowfin. Many of the administrative buildings and hangars on Hickam still bear their exterior scorch marks from the fires, as they were never repainted. It was always bizarre and ironic going to Hickam Elementary School, which is built around the landmark Hickam Water Tower, only to see that tower and grounds figure so prominently in the background of old stock photos of Battleship Row and later images of the attack. Yes, us clueless kids cheered when it looked like our hated school might get bombed in the old photos, and worse yet, we went home in the afternoon to watch Star Blazers with the adventures of the Space Battleship Yamato. And, of course, every gang of young impressionable boys has to do the Goonies-style search along the island's beaches for the missing Japanese midget submarine. I even remember fishing with my dad off the Pearl Harbor naval docks alongside all the moored crusiers and destroyers, and like all little boys trying to nimbly climb across the mooring lines to get on the warships. Growing up on Hickam in Hawaii was truly cool.

Then, in Oahu's Valley of the Temples, is the astoundingly beautiful replica of the ancient Hoo-do pavilion of the Byodo-in temple from Uji City, a 1960s peace gift to the islands from Japan, which makes for a surreal yet somehow sublime pairing after visiting the National Memorial Cemetary of the Pacific in Punchbowl Crater. Odd part of the uniquely mixed culture of an island whose population is today, as it was in 1941, majority Japanese-American and owes its much of its modern heritage to both sides of the Pacific.

[belfastuniguy 18]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228

Originally posted by: Taylor1

Originally posted by: The_Dalai_Llama Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.quote>

Yea, look at al-quida after bombing us a few times and stuff, we practically have them out of iraq and exsistance.quote>

 

where have you been getting your information? george bush? if we had driven them out of iraq/existence, our soldiers wouldn't be getting killed so much.quote>

Maybe Fox News???

Al Quida was never in Iraq in the first place..........they ARE now of course....

They also are far from being wiped from existence, how exactly do you hunt an enemy you can't see or has a central command structure???. Iraq has made things worse. I supported it, but it's ***** mess at the minute.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Good work, guys and gals.  I am glad to see some historical interest among you.

On the current mess with Al Q'aida, one wonders if we'll ever be free of them.  Their decentralized organization is like a set of communist cells, and they seem to be good at it.  Of course, they have history to learn from, and they have.  On top of that, they are somehow linked to Taliban in Pakhanistan as well.  This whole business reminds me of the anarchist movement prior to the World War.

[Taylor1 0]

Originally posted by: patriots_1228

Originally posted by: Taylor1

Originally posted by: The_Dalai_Llama Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.quote>

Yea, look at al-quida after bombing us a few times and stuff, we practically have them out of iraq and exsistance.quote>

 

where have you been getting your information? george bush? if we had driven them out of iraq/existence, our soldiers wouldn't be getting killed so much.quote>

No, but almost as credible sources like department of defense people. Our rate of troops dying has gone down WAY the HELL DOWN DUDE like there aren't alot of troops dying like there were a couple years ago or even a couple months ago. Our troops haven't been dying really at all lately don't get your news from iraq from the media go to credible government sites trust me there is a big diffrence, the media today right now is only covering bad things that happen not good things I.E. the survival rate of our soldiers in iraq/middle east.

[Taylor1 0]

Originally posted by: Taylor1

Originally posted by: patriots_1228

Originally posted by: Taylor1

Originally posted by: The_Dalai_Llama Pearl Harbor is an example of a day where Americans were at their best despite succumbing to the worst attack from an outside nation in over a century. We Americans don't like to be attacked... we will fight for our sovereignty if you provoke us, and Pearl Harbor reminds us of that.quote>

Yea, look at al-quida after bombing us a few times and stuff, we practically have them out of iraq and exsistance.quote>

 

where have you been getting your information? george bush? if we had driven them out of iraq/existence, our soldiers wouldn't be getting killed so much.quote>

No, but almost as credible sources like department of defense people. Our rate of troops dying has gone down WAY the HELL DOWN DUDE like there aren't alot of troops dying like there were a couple years ago or even a couple months ago. Our troops haven't been dying really at all lately don't get your news from iraq from the media go to credible government sites trust me there is a big diffrence, the media today right now is only covering bad things that happen not good things I.E. the survival rate of our soldiers in iraq/middle east. Also don't start get all demoKKKratic on me here i am just trying to give you a more positive thing to think about because its really happening and i do have proof of it and i don't watch fox news.

[belfastuniguy 18]

Yeah Dept. of Defence, because they are so reliable.

Numbers of troops being killed in Iraq is down purely because a large number of Iraqi militants fighting the allied forces have either stopped and are working to better their community or some have just resorted to targeting their actions on fellow Iraqis such as the recent car bombs and sorry to say not attributed to the actions of allied forces. Maybe if you watched international media you would know that. Government sites are hardly fountains of accurate or trustworthy information......

American forces in particular have not been that successful in stopping the attacks against them. The British had more success and as such have handed Basra back to the Iraqis and hopefully we will be gone by this time next year, with a tiny number maybe remaining.