We NEED a C:SL batting school.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

I see lots of people starting to build for C:SL

 

I see some great looking buildings... but I also see awesome ideas wasted because of some beginners mistakes that could be avoided
 

 

I see some old SC4 masters getting lost..

 

We NEED a C:SL batting school !

[Dubai Skyscraper 129]

Agree.. I barely download any buildings because I'm not comfortable with their quality. There's for example a Taipei 101 model in the workshop which looks awesome from a far, but once you zoom in you can see that the specularity map is, well, f*cked up.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Yeah LODs are still a mystery for most builders... I already saw some people in french forums telling about how their downloaded bats looked like crap when you zoom out.

 

I've lauched the idea in the paradox forums. Let's see how it catches on...

 

Lods are a thing but we also need to learn people how texture sizes can be used... and what works and doesn't with alphas and speculars.

[Ryno917 102]

Fully agree. The more/better resources the community has, the more and better assets will be released by modders.

 

I have a pretty good idea how to handle textures, and how the different ones will work (based on a LOT of experience with painting cars in a variety of racing sims with different functionalities in different textures), but I could probably use some help when it comes to creating good, photorealistic textures for my future buildings without having to resort to slapping a photograph on the front of it. A lot of my experience is more graphical, and less photorealistic.

 

There should also be some basic things to keep in mind. For instance, a LOT of the addon buildings I see right now have no AO, and a 1024 texture that covers the entire face of a building, so it looks low res up close, but really they should leverage tileable UV layouts to make the most out of the pixels (still possible while only using one texture if you plan your UV out carefully). Little things like that can go a long, long way to getting a higher quality end product.

 

I have a few buildings in mind, but I need to get reacquainted with polygonal modeling first, too. Any resource should include some links to good beginner modeling tutorials for a variety of programs (blender, 3ds and Maya for sure), as well as some tips and tricks that would be more specific to C:SL techniques and cover the peculiarities and constraints of C:SL.

 

[EDIT] Oh yes, a (well organized) resource pool would be great, too. Textures, basic props, etc.

[flatron 83]

I can only support that idea. I'd really love to create buildings of my own, but I can't even get my head around blender (too mathematical for my taste, being used to just playing around with shapes in gmax...)

[Extrenix 132]

The One WTC building has got to be one of the coolest from up close but worst from far away.

sure you guys seen it

[Cool_Z 1,547]

The One WTC building has got to be one of the coolest from up close but worst from far away.

sure you guys seen it

 

A link for it ?

[wallacet 336]

Yeah LODs are still a mystery for most builders... I already saw some people in french forums telling about how their downloaded bats looked like crap when you zoom out.

 

I've lauched the idea in the paradox forums. Let's see how it catches on...

 

Lods are a thing but we also need to learn people how texture sizes can be used... and what works and doesn't with alphas and speculars.

 

Would you mind explaining what LOD's are? I have been looking at getting back into modding (only done a few models in SC4, but want to make some for this game too!) and see the term "LOD" mentioned, but am not quite sure what it means.

[Panther6308 14]

Hi,

 

LOD mean Level Of Detail. For Cities: Skylines it mean a version of your building with 100 polygones (or less) and less detail on it. It is not necessary to reduce your building (i.e. make it smaller).

 

You can also put a lower version of your diffuse map. If you don't put a LOD version of your buidling, the game will create one automaticaly but it will not be beautiful.

 

Here is an extract from the wiki page on Assett http://www.skylineswiki.com/Asset_Editor

 

You may notice your custom models sometimes gets very distorted when viewed from far away : that's because the game automatically generates a low poly version (LOD) of your model and your texture in order to save resources. To solve this problem, you need to provide your own low poly version of the model (the fewest polys the better) and name it yourModelName_LOD.fbx

 

In the same way, you have to create a diffuse texture for this low-poly model, or the game will use an auto-generated one. You should name this texture with a "_lod_d" suffix (lowercase "lod" is important).

 

Pinky!

[Cool_Z 1,547]

LOD stands for Level Of Detail.

 

Game engines can't render all geometry all of the time, when an object is seen from far away its geometry is replaced with a LOD (a simpler object that looks the same but with less polygons).

 

When you zoom out in CSL you will notice that at some point the buildings become simpler, the textures will be replaced with smaller ones and the models will have less details. If you've set your graphic options to lower settings it will happen sooner. (and you'll notice how bad some models were made much sooner too).

 

The game asks for lods that are about 100 tris (100 triangular polygons, 50 quads) when a standard model in the game will be between 1000 and 2000.

 

You can import a building in the game without making a LOD for it. The game will "improvise" and create one on the fly... and it might look like crap. You can create your own lod and don't care about its texture... the game will "figure" how to use the big model's texture and it will look "almost right" (but only for small houses... for bigger buildings it still won't be ok).

 

The best is to have a correctly built LOD with its own textures (of a lower resolution than the big model, no need for crisp precision here, just a good fit.).

 

 

 

 

The panther beat me... I'm slow

 

Yeah the Lod must have the same name as the original model but with _LOD at the end... the lod's textures must have the suffix _lod added... but lowercase or it won't work (good joke csl devs... good joke...).

[Extrenix 132]

 

The One WTC building has got to be one of the coolest from up close but worst from far away.

sure you guys seen it

 

A link for it ?

 

here

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=411813740&searchtext=one+world

[Cool_Z 1,547]

 

 

The One WTC building has got to be one of the coolest from up close but worst from far away.

sure you guys seen it

 

A link for it ?

 

here

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=411813740&searchtext=one+world

 

 

OMG yep this is bad !!!!!! 

[Mr_Maison 2,426]

2 things I want to learn is how to make a proper LOD model and texture color balance for the game.

[wallacet 336]

So essentially you create the texture-less model and then save 2 identical versions, one for the regular model and then the LOD version, and apply proper textures to each? Or do you have to save the regular version model, and then take off balconies, doors, awnings, etc. for the LOD version?

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Here's how I went for the two released bats I have and the one that's about to be finished.

 

I made the full version, fully textured.

 

Then I create a very simplified version that will fit the full one as close as possible. I model it with the full one present as a model. I go for simple geometry as much as I can. I found it was simpler to build back from scratch than to fight with a complex model and sacrifice things.

If some parts are already simple geometry, you can use those parts in the lod version, but for balconies, windows and doors, and some details it's really much faster to make a simpler model than remove details from a complex one.

 

I uvunwrap the simplified one... and then I make a texture bake from the full one onto the simplified one. Means the appearance of the full model will be painted onto the simpler one. It might not be perfect and a few touch-up might be needed, but it's pretty accurate actually.

[Mr_Maison 2,426]

So if the building was made with a simple box or very low polygons to begin with, there would be no need to make a LOD model? Maybe just reduced quality texture?

[Cool_Z 1,547]

So if the building was made with a simple box or very low polygons to begin with, there would be no need to make a LOD model? Maybe just reduced quality texture?

 

No... because the lod should be 100 tris or less (for a standard growable, I don't know if a big huge ploppable can have a bigger poly count.).

 

That's why you have to make another simplified model.

[Mr_Maison 2,426]

 

So if the building was made with a simple box or very low polygons to begin with, there would be no need to make a LOD model? Maybe just reduced quality texture?

 

No... because the lod should be 100 tris or less (for a standard growable, I don't know if a big huge ploppable can have a bigger poly count.).

 

That's why you have to make another simplified model.

 

What I meant is if the poly count is under 100 to begin with, is it necessary to make a LOD model? A cube that have 6 faces would end up in 12 triangles. A building with simple cornices at the roof and a box for the body would not amount to 100 tris. In this case I would think making a LOD would be redundant because you can't really go much simpler than that. Or is it just a necessity? I do understand now why we need to make them. But what about the most simple shaped models that are under 100 tris even at the close up level like a simple little bush. Would the automatic LOD destroy that?

[Cool_Z 1,547]

 

 

So if the building was made with a simple box or very low polygons to begin with, there would be no need to make a LOD model? Maybe just reduced quality texture?

 

No... because the lod should be 100 tris or less (for a standard growable, I don't know if a big huge ploppable can have a bigger poly count.).

 

That's why you have to make another simplified model.

 

What I meant is if the poly count is under 100 to begin with, is it necessary to make a LOD model? A cube that have 6 faces would end up in 12 triangles. A building with simple cornices at the roof and a box for the body would not amount to 100 tris. In this case I would think making a LOD would be redundant because you can't really go much simpler than that. Or is it just a necessity? I do understand now why we need to make them. But what about the most simple shaped models that are under 100 tris even at the close up level like a simple little bush. Would the automatic LOD destroy that?

 

 

Well this has to be tested but I think it will be much better to make a lod even if it's the same model... the game shouldn't change the geometry if you zoom out when the model is simple enough (and I already think it won't). But... If you don't make a texture for the lod the game will create a lowres version of the main model's textures... and it does it very poorly.

 

You then should just use a duplicate of your main model, and make smaller (512*512 is ok, I tried with 256 and I noticed the game made them look very bad, maybe it was resizing them to 512... the filesize difference isn't very big) textures for it.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

I've made a list of things that I noticed could be a problem (or already are) for some builders :

 

 

- Software : Some people want to build but ask what they can use for it. Some use sketchup (which can be ok if they know what they do) but have huge difficulties going further because of the way sketchup works and the model conversion needed afterwards.

 

- Uv mapping : Some builders have already worked for SC4 but have a very hard time unwrapping a model to texture it for CSL

 

- Model scale : People need to have an idea of what is a proper sized building

 

- Repetitive or basic textures : Some models present textures with very repetitive textures... or too flat ones.

 

- Polygon count : Some models have a very high poly count. It can be necessary for big buildings but should be avoided for smaller ones

 

- Texture size : Some builders use huge textures for small buildings... or on the contrary use a texture too small (example, I've seen a 100m tall building that was using only a 512 texture).

 

- How to use the different textures : diffuse, specular, alpha... all these need explanations on how they work and their limits

 

- LODs : lods are required when you zoom out or play with low graphical settings... many models lack a good looking lod and will look ugly when seen from a distance.

 

- How to export from the 3D soft and import into the asset editor.

 

- The floor count in the asset editor for buildings using glass : I've seen some buildings misusing the "internal glass system"

 

- Making growables fit into the right category : I've seen small buildings made into level 5 high residential, and towers made into level 4.

[spa 970]

Sounds like a series of tutorials is needed (perhaps for the Simtropolis omnibus). You seem to have good handle on things and have made some good models. Maybe you could get the ball rolling with one? I'm keen to model for Skylines, but I'm a SC4 gmax modeller and I have no clue how to work with the uvw unwrap stuff or with low polygon models (never had to worry about that before). I would certainly value anything produced.

[sandrasim1 2]

Hi!

 

I haven't been around here for many years but I used to create lots and bats for SC4 years ago. During the past 5 years I have been creating objects for Sims 3 which has taught me new skills like low polygon modelling, unwrapping (which was a PITA for me to learn but apparently I survived to ordeal ) and texture baking.

 

Sims 4 turned out to be a major disaster and I had no idea about CSL until February this year. It was a pure accident I found out about it. I bought it just two weeks ago so everything is still new to me but I am already thinking about creating buildings again. Maybe not tomorrow but in a very near future. I am using 3ds max 2013 for modelling and unwrapping.

 

I have ModTools installed and you can use it to extract the mesh and textures from the vanilla buildings in the game. You have to do it inside the game though. It can be used to set up guidelines for polygon count of various buildings from single family homes to high rises.

 

My preferred way to model is to start with a high poly mesh, continue with a low poly mesh and finally bake the high poly mesh to the low poly mesh (baking the normal map). That gives me the regular model that will be used by the game engine. The last step would be to reduce the low poly mesh to a lod with 100 tris or less. Clear as mud but I have never been good at explaining things.

 

While I think I can handle the modelling and unwrapping part there are still questions about textures, scaling... things that are specific to this game.

 

I think this is enough for now but I am definitely interested to learn more.

 

BTW, Cool_Z, I'm sorry that people are giving you negative comments about your buildings. I love them and look forward to seeing them grow when my city gets larger.

[Cool_Z 1,547]

Sounds like a series of tutorials is needed (perhaps for the Simtropolis omnibus). You seem to have good handle on things and have made some good models. Maybe you could get the ball rolling with one? I'm keen to model for Skylines, but I'm a SC4 gmax modeller and I have no clue how to work with the uvw unwrap stuff or with low polygon models (never had to worry about that before). I would certainly value anything produced.

 

Yes I think I could do some of them (and compile some good tutorials about low poly and uvmapping, there already are tons of them around)

 

Hi!

 

I haven't been around here for many years but I used to create lots and bats for SC4 years ago. During the past 5 years I have been creating objects for Sims 3 which has taught me new skills like low polygon modelling, unwrapping (which was a PITA for me to learn but apparently I survived to ordeal ) and texture baking.

 

Sims 4 turned out to be a major disaster and I had no idea about CSL until February this year. It was a pure accident I found out about it. I bought it just two weeks ago so everything is still new to me but I am already thinking about creating buildings again. Maybe not tomorrow but in a very near future. I am using 3ds max 2013 for modelling and unwrapping.

 

I have ModTools installed and you can use it to extract the mesh and textures from the vanilla buildings in the game. You have to do it inside the game though. It can be used to set up guidelines for polygon count of various buildings from single family homes to high rises.

 

My preferred way to model is to start with a high poly mesh, continue with a low poly mesh and finally bake the high poly mesh to the low poly mesh (baking the normal map). That gives me the regular model that will be used by the game engine. The last step would be to reduce the low poly mesh to a lod with 100 tris or less. Clear as mud but I have never been good at explaining things.

 

While I think I can handle the modelling and unwrapping part there are still questions about textures, scaling... things that are specific to this game.

 

I think this is enough for now but I am definitely interested to learn more.

 

BTW, Cool_Z, I'm sorry that people are giving you negative comments about your buildings. I love them and look forward to seeing them grow when my city gets larger.

 

Oh yess uvunwrapping is a tedious task. Once you really get that part the rest is pure bliss compared ot it.

 

The comments about my builds (see my bat topic for those wondering what we're talking about) annoys me most because it's a game bug related problem and I can't do nothing but wait for colossal to fix it... but I've got positive ones too and that makes it ok in the end. 

 

 

Edit : I just realized you talked about modtools. I will start using this because I'm curious about some released workshop models with no stats... I'm certain some are very high poly. (And I'm already certain some have no LOD at all... I came across a wonderful looking recycling center yesterday... that looked like a car wreck when you zoom out.)

[Mr_Maison 2,426]

What exactly is ModTools? Nevermind. Found the description on Steam.