Daisy Chaining

[+Guest]

Hey guys I need help. I have my main central CBD hub and I want to daisy chain power into it from surrounding suburbs (separate cities) to create realism (instead of having a power plant right in the middle of downtown). The problem is when I connect a power line into the CBD to initiate a power deal, when I hover over cities the power lines connect as power lines rather than into buildings. So basically I cannot create a power grid without having this annoying physical connection. Is there a way around this?

[Prophet42 1,501]

For a power deal the power lines that connect to the neighbor must run at least to within four grid squares of a zone.  Basically they must follow the same rules as other power lines or zones do to be able to provide power.  Zones and power lines can provide power up to four neighboring grid squares away.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Also, I have found it is easier to get a power deal started when you start the city.  Just bring the power lines from the border to the first zones you create.

[+Guest]

I dont understand. I cannot seem to fix my problem. 

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Try removing all other power sources from the city.  If it doesn't work, don't save.

[infamousjbe 592]

You also have to make sure that the city that's supplying the power has enough excess power to give to the adjacent city tiles. I would assume you'd have to have more than 1000mw over your cities usage in order to start any kind of deal.

 

When you make a power line neighbor connection, you don't need to make sure the  power line is at least four grid squares deep in the neighboring city for the connection to work. Once the connection is made from the city you're playing (supplying), as long as there is enough overflow of power, there shouldn't be any reason why it wouldn't work. 

 

I also thought the power line that's entering the city has to actually connect with the power grid to be able to "use" the energy? Or in order to supply the next adjacent city tile, the power line would in fact have to span the entire city tile and create another neighboring connection in order to daisy chain?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

You might want to have a look at It allows smaller increments for deals.

[.anonyman 28]

To answer the original question, those power lines MUST exist at the edges of both cities for the power deal to work. I couldn't find confirmation of this in the Prima guide, but I'm pretty sure. Because the power lines are ugly and inconvenient, I personally like to place small industrial zones in both cities; then some high-voltage lines look more natural.

 

It seems like an opportunity for someone to make power lines that look like something else, so that the neighbor deals are possible but we don't have to look at power lines in the middle of a city.

[infamousjbe 592]

To answer the original question, those power lines MUST exist at the edges of both cities for the power deal to work. I couldn't find confirmation of this in the Prima guide, but I'm pretty sure. Because the power lines are ugly and inconvenient, I personally like to place small industrial zones in both cities; then some high-voltage lines look more natural.

 

It seems like an opportunity for someone to make power lines that look like something else, so that the neighbor deals are possible but we don't have to look at power lines in the middle of a city.

There are quite a few power line/poles/conduits lots on the LEX that would do the trick.

 

since I-A tiles need power, they can also transfer power in the same way as any other, so you can zone 1x1 I-A square every four grid squares apart to deliver power across a map without actually having to plop down any lots. If you have a lot of trees around your city, you wouldn't even see the zoned 1x1 I-A zoned squares.

 

I actually use these to chain power across distant zones in my rural cities.

 

And FYI, There are high power lines running through my neighborhood just a few blocks down the road. They are connected to a couple substations, but the lines run for miles in both directions. 

[jeffryfisher 2,176]

What if I want to pull in 2000 MW from the south so I can then export 1000 MW of it to the north? So far, I have only been able to import the one increment that would be sufficient locally. I'm just not being offered deals that could create a surplus to be passed along. Is there a mod that will let me buy a surplus?

[infamousjbe 592]

Look at the link that Nonny posted, that might help a bit. 

 

But as far as I know, by default, if you want to pass on power to the next city, the current city has to have an excess of at least 1000MWs to pass on. 

 

With the mod installed that Nonny posted, you can actually make deals for much less than the default. Which is really nice for the larger farming cities that don't use much power. Sometimes trying to manage a bunch of windmill power plants can be such a pain in the tuchus.

[cogeo 960]

Inability to sign deals, is often due to a restriction posed by the Neighbor Deals tuning settings: a city may not sign deals higher than 2.5 times "its needs" (consumption plus export deals). Apparently the game makes an exception for new/empty cities, allowing a deal equal to the minimum deal amount (1000MWh/mo). And while 2.5 times might look very reasonable (even "too much"), there are some cases where this causes problems:

- If you have started a city that with windmills (200MWh/mo), you will have to grow it enough, so that it needs at least three windmills (which are quite costly btw), before you can sign a deal to import some dirty cheap power from your industrial neighbour. Why? The minimum deal amount is 1000MWh/mo, so your city must be using at least 400MWh/mo, and this requires three windmills (or maybe two overfunded ones, utilised more than 90%, but this caused them to wear fast).

- If you have a new city, you can only import the minimum deal amount (1000MWh/mo) and there is no power left to sell to the next neighbour. You must grow this city so that needs at least 800MWh/mo, before you can upgrade your deal to 2000MWh, and then I'm not sure if you can export 1000MWh/mo of the remaining (less than 1200MWh/mo) ones to the next neighbour, because your city will be left with less than 200MW/h, and therefore the simulator may not grant you the deal. Maybe if you (temporarily) enact the Power Conservation ordinance (requires saving the city, exiting and reloading), power consumption will fall, and there may be enough power to sell so the simulator will finally grant you the deal, but I'm not sure.

 

So in conclusion, "Daisy Chaining" does NOT work with the default settings, unless you develop the city at the end of the chain (one at a time)!

 

I have posted a set of on the STEX, which allows deals of 500 or 250 MWh/mo (works for water deals too).

 

I believe it is possible to extend the chain a little using these mods:

- First, you must have a city (A) with a surplus of power.

- Then, without having any of the mods installed, sign a deal to export 1000MWh to city B. Save and exit to desktop.

- Install the 500MWh mod, run the game and open city C.

- Check if you can sign a deal to import 500MWh from B. Save and exit.

- Now remove the 500MWh mod, install the 250MWh one,run the game and open city D.

- Check if you can sign a deal to import 250MWh from C. Save and exit to region.

City B now uses 500MWh, and it may be possible to increase the deal to 1250MWh (not sure though).

 

The above procedure might require some extra steps, but if it works it can extend the chain by two cities, which is quite a bit (and sufficient in many cases). And if someone modifies these mods, so that they allow a buyer to import as much as say 5.0 or why not 10.0 times its needs (instead of 2.5), it can even be extended yet more. It is even possible (and very easy actually) to make a mod that sets the minimum deal amount to even 1MWh/mo. In such a case the importing city will likely be presented with a menu consisting of the excess power of the selling city divided in tenths (just like with garbage deals) but it may not work at all, rendering daisy chaining impossible, not sure.

 

If someone wishes to try the above, I would be willing to help. And please, let us know the results. I may even post an update for these mods.

[infamousjbe 592]

Or you can just use this substation in each city along the power lines without any of the NIMBY effects of the plants. You shouldn't have anymore power issues with this technique. You'll also be able to daisy chain each city tile easier than trying to keep boosting from the center (plant) to the outer tiles.

 

And if ya think about it, it's not cheating or bending the rules since in RL, there are such things as substations that do just that, boost power to the local area.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

An interesting set of mods, but in RL such stations do not generate power.  Daisy chaining is tricky but possible.  It is just that you have to build each city outward from the hub and work slowly towards the periphery.

 

Frankly, unless the terrain is very accommodating, I don't bother with this as a problem solving exercise any more.

[jeffryfisher 2,176]

Inability to sign deals, is often due to a restriction posed by the Neighbor Deals tuning settings: a city may not sign deals higher than 2.5 times "its needs" (consumption plus export deals). Apparently the game makes an exception for new/empty cities, allowing a deal equal to the minimum deal amount

[cogeo 960]

I for one would very much like to see the deal limit raised. Can we also enable a zero-power city to import anything from 1 to 5 times the minimum?

 

The 2.5x limit can be changed very easily. Open one of my mods in the reader and edit it (they contain a single exemplar).

Offering 1-5 times the minimum isn't possible I think (searched the LUA scripts but didn't find it). It seems that the deal amout and cost are calculated in the executable's code.

[infamousjbe 592]

An interesting set of mods, but in RL such stations do not generate power.  Daisy chaining is tricky but possible.  It is just that you have to build each city outward from the hub and work slowly towards the periphery.

 

Frankly, unless the terrain is very accommodating, I don't bother with this as a problem solving exercise any more.

Was indeed aware that the substations are not in fact power stations themselves. If my memory severs me correct, I believe they only use existing power to  "boost" or "amplify" the power to the surrounding areas.

[cogeo 960]

Was indeed aware that the substations are not in fact power stations themselves. If my memory severs me correct, I believe they only use existing power to  "boost" or "amplify" the power to the surrounding areas.

 

Substations can distribute, transform (high->medium or medium->low voltage), improve (eg reduce the phase angle between voltage and current) or control power, but not really "boost" or "amplify" it, as they lack generation capability; and any conversion apparatus or device actually has (small) losses.

[infamousjbe 592]

 

Was indeed aware that the substations are not in fact power stations themselves. If my memory severs me correct, I believe they only use existing power to  "boost" or "amplify" the power to the surrounding areas.

 

Substations can distribute, transform (high->medium or medium->low voltage), improve (eg reduce the phase angle between voltage and current) or control power, but not really "boost" or "amplify" it, as they lack generation capability; and any conversion apparatus or device actually has (small) losses.

 

Cool, thanks for the clarification. I always prefer to know than assume. 

 

I'm use to the term High Power line, but never really looked at the others as "med" & "low", though it does makes sense when used as such.