Tutorial on the use and organization of the Plugins folders

[Cobb32118 244]

Date:5/20/2004 8:45:03 AM
Author:GrampaAl
[...]
Have you looked at the store fronts of large buildings in the normal game? Yes? Now try this for the large BAT buildings. What do you see? Nothing? Just as I thought.

Ours will generally show you something. You never know what, it depends on my mood when I do this. Heck I might even swear at you. Well actually that is not may nature, so I won't. BUT I COULD!

quote>

GrampaA1, do you mean the building doesn't query on large BATs?  This is true for buildings loaded as props and put onto blank lots (usually the case for RCI ploppables).  But for growables and landmarks, my BAT buildings query just the same as the Maxis ones.  If you meant something different, then disregard. 

[pekeboo01 3]

Date: 5/20/2004 9:12:26 AM
Author:
I suggest you re-read the posts above.

quote>
Sorry Grampa,
Not fully awake and functional yet.

[Jutlander79 8]

I think we should have a standard of the lotmaking.

The author of the lot should (before they zip the file) make a directory with the name with the lots name and under dirs if the lot are ploppale/growable/landmark a pic of the lot + a readme file with a little description what the lot dos.

THIS SHOULD NOT BE TO HARD TO DO WHEN U USE SERVAL HOURS TO DO THE LOTS

This should make the lot organizing a lot easier.
I will send 2 example files to illustrate it better.
THE FIRST ONE IS TO ILLUSTRATE WHAT I MEAN
THE SECOND ONE IS TO ILLUSTRATE HOW IM ORGANIZING

[Jutlander79 8]

THE SECOND ONE IS TO ILLUSTRATE HOW IM ORGANIZING

ANOTHER THING THAT SHOULD BE GREAT IS TO MAKE SUBDIR IN THE GAME IT SELF FOR EX HAVE SEPERATE FOLDERS FOR PARKS AND PLAZAS

[Bazaritchie 0]

hey every1 im pretty new here and hav downloaded afew stuff and after checkin to see where all the files go i got confused abit.

could someone give an example or sumthing to show where the files go?

ok tell me if this is one of the right ways to do it, ill use GDV-Waterfront Hotel for an example

c:\My Doc\SC4\Plugins\GDV-Waterfront Hotel\filename.SC4lot (All.SC4lot files)

and

C:\Program Files\Maxis\SimCity 4\Plugins\GDV-Waterfront Hotel\filename.(SC4Desc/SC4Model/DAT)

with NO image or text files anywhere in the plugins folder at all.

is this a good way to organise the files? if not can anyone give me sum pointers?

[Jutlander79 8]

if I was u I should create a subfolder to your pluggin dir ex
GDV-Waterfront Hotel is an commercial building then I should have it in my subfolder called ex RCI COMMERCIAL LOTS beacause u will notice soon that there are many great lots at the Lotexchange and your Dir will soon be cluttering. Thats beacause I have the lots in different subfolders if u look at my org attachment
c:\My Doc\SC4\Plugins\RCI COMMERCIAL LOTS\GDV-Waterfront Hotel\filename.SC4lot

And u skilled simtropolis lotmaker keep em comming so we can filled the spaces that Maxis missed

HERE ARE SOME BUNNIES FOR U OUTTHERE

[deadwoods 542]

They say a picture is worth a thousand words, so hopefully I'll be able to save a few thousand with my file structures. I've just spent two evenings reorganising my SC-relates files and directories and thought some screen shots and explanations may help. GrampaAl, please correct me if I got it wrong.

I've basically got three directories for lot/plugin-related files, the two created when you install SC, and one I use for managing/storing the custom lots. Note, in the following I'll use folder and directory interchangeably.

Program Files Plugins folder

First is the Program Files Plugins folder (referred to as the Main Plugins folder by GrampaAl) which is normally c:\Program Files\Maxis\SimCity 4\Plugins.

Within this folder I have sub folders (directories) for different types of files:

• BATS - this folder contains the .sc4model and .sc4desc files associated with the BAT buildings (and props). Because there are (or will be) so many BAT files, I've subdivided the folder into sub folders named after the BAT authors.
  
• Mods - this folder contains the .dat files for the mods I've downloaded from the Mods section of ST (such as the transit bugfix and Trolca's dirt roads mods).
  
• Props - this folder contains the .dat files containing props (such as the CSX and GrampaAl's mjb prop packs). Again, as there are so many, I've sub divided the folder into sub folders named after the author.
  
• Sundry_dats - this folder contains the other .dat files (i.e. ones that don't fit into any of the existing categories) such as PEG's park and trail kit lot collections. Perhaps these should be in the My Documents Plugins folder?
  
• Textures - this folder contains the .dat files for the textures. As the number of these grow, I may subdivide the files.

So I've got all .sc4model, .sc4desc and .dat files in the Program Files Plugins folder (except for some one's I'm developing and haven't released to STEX), with the files placed in sub-folders based on use/type and in some cases author.

My Documents Plugins folder

The next folder is the My Documents Plugins folder (referred to as the Secondary Plugins folder by GrampaAl), normally My Documents\SimCity 4\Plugins.

This folder contains all of my .sc4lot files. The folder is subdivided into sub-folders based on the author (such as BLS, CSX, DEDWD). Where there are many files (such as CSX), I've subdivided into lot types.

I also have all files for BAT's/Lot's I'm developing in the My Documents Plugins folder so that the Plugin Manager and Lot Editor can see them. If I'm working on BAT's/Lot's, I may need to copy .dat files into this directory temporarily.

So all of my .sc4lot files are in the My Documents Plugins directory (plus any in development .sc4model, .sc4desc and .dat files) and the lot files are subdivided by author and type.

A Downloads folder

Finally, I have a downloads directory to help me manage the hundreds of custom lots and mods on my system. You do not need to use this to use custom lots in the game, it's just how I manage my files. This folder is My Documents\SC4_Downloads.

This folder is used to download and keep all of the custom lots and mods I get from ST.

I have a _new subfolder that is the default download location for my browser, so when I click on the download link, the file goes there automatically. This is my incoming queue; i.e. where I review the lot and extract files for the Plugins folders.

The other folders are for permanent record of what I've got on my system. I have a sunbfolder for the lot authors (e.g. BLS). Within that are directories for each lot named after the lot zip file, such as the BLS De Groot Lime Farm folder (WinZip has a great facility to extract the files to a directory named after the zip file). This gives me something to check when I find something interesting on the STEX, but I'm not sure if I've already got it.

So how do I use the folders. Let say I've found a nice lot on the STEX. I then...

1. Check to make sure I don't already have the lot under the My Documents\SC4_Downloads directory.
   
2. Download the lot (automatically goes into my _new subdirectory)
   
3. Unzip the lot file into a new subdirectory with the same name (using the WinZip function).
   
4. Read the README to see what dependencies the lot has. If there are any I repeat the entire process for each of them. The README also gives any hints on usage requirements (does the lot need water/power, should a pre-zone etc.).
   
5. Copy any .sc4model and .sc4desc files to the Program Files Plugins folder (appropriate BATS subdirectory).
   
6. Copy any .dat textures/props/other files to the Program Files Plugins folder (appropriate subdirectory, such as Textures or Props).
   
7. Copy the .sc4lot files to the My Documents Plugins folder (appropriate author/type subdirectory)
   
8. Move the entire download directory from _new to the appropriate My Documents\SC4_Downloads directory (e.g. BLS).

This seems to work so far.

One thing I've noticed, and it will get worse, is the issue of pre-req files (i.e. all the props and textures). I know it's been discussed in a number of thread recently. It would be great if we had a clever download tool, so that when you clicked on a lot to download, it would look at the dependencies and automatically get them for you. I know it's a pipe dream, but...

[GrampaAl 76]

I had earlier decided to not say anymore on this thread. However, deadwoods has it just exactly correct. Thanks for the few thousand words deadwoods.

PEG's .dat files contain BOTH lots AND props, plus Textures also. So placing them in the Main directory as you have described so well is also correct.

Thanks for the final clarification. You have done it better than I have and I thank you for this.

[deadwoods 542]

Thanks. I spent half an hour composing and typing it before IE spat the dummy, so I've been entering it in stages. I think you posted before I got the last bit done. Now I've gotta figure out why the horizontal rules disappeared.

[cow 1]

i am working this entire process into my tutorial on organizing and editing downloaded lots as well. deadwoods has a very good system going, and has done a good job explaining it. he seems to have a talent that i possess as well, which is clearly and concisely getting a message across so that ANYONE can understand it, especially people that are new to simcity and simtropolis.

of course, my file organization is completely different than deadwoods, but to each their own.

[tkirch 4]

All of this information is great and I understand where I put it.

First is there a program out there that makes it easier to take a number of files and seperate them.

Secondly how does the system decide which files go on top in the menus. Like if there is a park I use a lot how can I get it to go to the top of the list in the parks menu or is there no way to do that?


Thank you

[GrampaAl 76]

Not sure I understand the first part of your question.
Taking files apart? If you mean moving or organizing them, then the program is the built in windows explorer.

Second, the order of appearance on a menu is determined by two things.

Using ilives reader program (available in the downloads section) you can open a lot file and edit properties.
The main property that controls the item order is the Item order property. The lower the number the closer to the top of the menu the item appears.

That is not all however. The Plop cost is also a factor. A lot with the item order property set to zero, AND the plop cost ALSO set to zero, then the lot will appear at the top of the menu (along with any other lots that have zero cost.

All ploppable lots however, should have SOME cost, unless they are something like a blank lot this is only used for the building of lots, and normally not used within the game itself.

[GrampaAl 76]

OK folks, an update to this thread.

Since some new conflicts between Prop files and BAT files have now been unearthed (we think), I am changing my recommendation for the placement of the BAT files.

In order to give the BAT files a higher priority that existing prop files (I know many of the Prop files ARE BAT files), I recommend all PROPS be located in a subfolder of the Main Plugins directory.

I then recommend that all BAT files (including the props made by the BAT) be placed in the MyDocs plugin directory or a sub folder there.

The train mods by Trolca and the resulting Props by Gizmo28, should go into the Main Plugins directory.

So for those BAT files which have been discovered to have conflicts with these mods, the BAT files will take priority. Sorry Trolca and Gizmo28, but it seems that is what the community would prefer.

Note, that only the .sc4model files which have as the last digits of the file name 0x030000 are affected at this time. But who knows what the future may hold.

Hey, I now worry about a possible expansion pack causing trememdous trouble for our custom items. Always has been a risk and maybe that day is just around the corner now.

[dolphin66 5]

OK...now I am completely confused. (happens alot)[:0]...I have had to reformat my computer due to spyware that I couldn't get off my computer. It should be illegal for spyware to even exist but back to topic....Before I download the hundreds of lots and bats I want, I want to make sure that I have it right the first time. I understand the different folders and where to put them until the last post made by Granmpa Al. This is my understanding, short and simple, all files except for props go into my doc folders? Wouldn't it be easier for all to have Gizmo and Trocola fix their prop files so they don't conflict before having to reorganize our folders? I also found out that when downloading a lot, you can click open instead of save and just copy the files to wherever they need to go without downloading them to your computer. Is this not a good way of doing things?

[GrampaAl 76]

I am sorry you are confused. Actually people need to be fairly advanced to even know what a prop is, it would seem.

 

All the building props released by Maxis are props. Many of the BAT creations are also props.

 

Even the huge skyscrapers from the BAT creators CAN be props.

 

So, how to sort this all out.

 

Those things that you want to have a higher priority that others can be places in the MyDocs Plugins directory.

 

Now that we know (or suspect) that some mods (Gizmo's train props) MAY cause a conflict, I would simply move THOSE to the Main Plugins folder structure. That way they have a lower priority.

 

If sacrifices have to be made, this is the way to do it.

 

As for the methods you use to download files, that is entirely up to the user. Whatever works for you is fine.

 

And last as for Gizmo fixing things. No, I don't ask this. In fact I disagree. He had these going long before BAT and this is a risk we all run when modding the files of a program.

 

Also his props are already used in many lots by many people. Changing them now will mess up those lots for future downloaders.

 

A second set could be released, but I would not ask for that either.

 

For those that have a problem with a specific lot due to conflicts, well we may just have to bite the bullet and sacrifice that specifit lot.

 

Regards, GrampaAl

[buckbeach 8]

Ok the SC4Desc and SC4Model files go back up stairs to My Docs.

 

You Said Those things that you want to have a higher priority that others can be places in the MyDocs Plugins directory.  I must of been really been off in my original understanding of the  instructions  to make sure that BldgProps 1 & 2 were placed in the Program Props (and in priortiy order) to been certain they were loaded prior to any other files.

[eusair 0]

i understand what buckbeach said about conflicting information, but this confusion, on my part, may be due to the fact that i have not yet begun to explore the properties and functionality of either the LE or the BAT utilities.

my real intention here is to represent the newbie user who's jaw dropped at discovering so many amazing and thoughtful additions; one can't help but wonder why they weren't included to begin with. after spending a great deal of time downloading and trying out a few hundred of these files, it occurred to me that to place all of them into the game at the same time is, perhaps, as ridiculous as a devising a universal organization scheme for them outside of the game.

as has been pointed out in this thread, people do things in different ways, resulting in endless combinations of sub-folders and sub-sub-folders in the two plugin directories. certainly, there are some methods that would be better than all the others, but, to simplify things a bit, it is rather difficult to miss. that said, why has not more attention been spent on organizing these plugins INSIDE the game.

while i have read this thread twice over and have heeded the advice to suite me, i still find that the real problem of organization has not been addressed, at least, not to my knowledge. i do not see myself enjoying these files in my cities without a more efficient method of locating them during gameplay.

cheers!

[dolphin66 5]

I myself have had no real problems with any downloaded lots except for a few that wanted to grow where they weren't suppose too. The one lot that was mentioned in the beginning of all this, I have and always thought it was just a glitch in the game. I am not going to stress over this small issue anymore as it really doesn't effect the game preformance or appearance for. I understand how to organize my plugin folders now and understand the need to download them instead of just opening and coping.  So to all that are trying to work the bugs out of the certain mods..good luck and hope that someone comes up with a solution to the problem. Thank you Grampa Al for all your helpful advise and information on this subject.

[GrampaAl 76]

There are two Plugins folders installed with the normal install of SimCity4.

The main Plugins folder is in the following path:

C:\Program File\Maxis\SimCity4\Plugins

 

This folder is where all of the Maxis supplied .dat files are normally stored. Landmarks, bldgprops_vol1.dat, bldgprops_vol2.dat and so on.

 

Now while it is not really necessary to have any sub folders under this directory, I find that if you use any mods that overwrite normal game settings, this is where I like to place them, mainly to keep them organized and to help me find them when I want them.

The only mods I use in this area are the traffic bug fixes, the transportation mods, and various graph mods.

 

These type of mods over ride the normal game settings, and that is why I like to place them here. These have no effect on lots or BAT files created by uses.

----------

The secondary Plugins folder is in the following path:

C:\MyDocuments\Maxis\SimCity4\Plugins

 

This folder is where Maxis has instructed us to place our custom LE (Lot Editor) and BAT (Building Architect tool) creations. The LE writes all changes to any lots edited to this folder. The BAT also writes all exported files here as well. In addition, the PM (Plugin Manager) also only uses this directory to load the model files and to write it's building and/or prop files.

 

This directory can rapidly get crowded with files with really long file names and become confusing in a big hurry.

 

So, it is under this folder (directory) that I like to create a set of sub directories to keep things organized. Now keep in mind that anything you move OUT of the plugins folder into one of these sub folders is no longer available to the Plugins Manager.
Files stored in a sub folder can still be loaded by the LE, but will not be changed by the LE when you are editing a lot.

 

This secondary plugins folder, should be thought of as the WORKING directory. It is here that any work that you do to your own LE or BAT creations will occur.

If you do a Save with the LE a brand new copy of he lot you have edited will be written into the Plugins sub folder. However, this brand new copy will contain only those things affected by the lot editor and other items you may have added by tweaking and so on, will NOT be saved along with the new file.

 

If you do a SaveAs, the exact same thing happens except that the file name written to the plugins directory is YOUR new file name, AND a new and unique iid (Instance ID) will be appended to your new file. The original is still retained in the sub folder to which you moved it.

 

These may now be futher edited or tweaked with one of the various tweaking programs.

(WARNING! If you now try to re-open one of your lot creations that you have Saved without creating a new iid, and the original is still in the Sub folder) any work you may do will actually be work on the original (since it was loaded last) and you will NOT BE ABLE TO SAVE IT, since a file of the same name now already exists in the plubins folder) It is important to realize this. It will save you a lot of time and frustration once you do. It is for this reason that I ALWAYS do a save as if I can.

If you can't, then you should exit the LE right away, and move the original into another folder which is NOT in the path of this secondary sub folder, before continuing.

You should keep these new files in the plugins directory until you are finished and satisfied with them. Once you arrive at this point, I recommend moving your finished creation into a sub folder which you create yourself.

 

I keep this secodary plugins folder clean of ALL files until I am ready to work on them.

----------

All downloads that I don't want to work on or that I don't even want in the game when I play, I move entirely out of the path of the secondary plugins folder, into a temp folder, or on the desktop or into a separate set of folders, also named and organized for my own convenience.

----------

Having tons of various files in either of your plugins directories can cause the game to load slow, run slow and increases the odds of having conflicts with other mods or lots which MAY have errors and so on.

 

The names and organization of the sub folders and any additional sub folders under these as well is entirely up to your own methods of organizing your own thoughts.

 

----------

Now, here is something for you to understand.

 

When the SimCity4 game or the LE (Lot editor) are loaded they load files in a specific order. This order is determined by your subfolders.

 

All the normal SimCity4 game items from the SimCity4_1.dat file are loaded first. Next all items in the Main plugins folders are loaded next, and those are followed by any items in sub folders here, loading one sub folder and it's subordinate sub folder at a time until all are loaded.

 

Next all the items in the Secondary plugins folder are loaded, followed by any items in sub folders here including those in the subordinate sub folders, until all items here are loaded. It is at this point when all files are loaded, that the Game or the LE are visible and available to use.

 

Note that in the event something in a sub folder has the same unique iid, as something previously loaded, in the load order, the latest file (which is in a sub folder or even a subordinate sub folder will be the item used).

 

OK, I went on to long and this is clear as mud right?

 

Sorry, but it is all needed to understand the file loading order.

 

I suggest you copy and paste this tutorial into note pad or your favorite word processor. Then you can study it, make notes for yourself and so on.

 

This is how I learned and it worked for me.

[chuck1959 0]

Hi all,

I am a $%&^! around here, but not to computers. However, I fully understand the way this message board works.

I'd first like to say that there is one heck of a lot of wealth of information here. If I could afford it, I'd send some simoleans to help out with the site.

What I do seem to see is a lack of, maybe?, of the how's and why's of downloading and installing NON Maxis programming.

As an example, I can peruse the Map Exchange and some have a .jpg AND a .bmp, while others don't. I am NOT here to complain or say it is wrong, but there needs to be some kind of standard submittal process, so that one How To guide can be written, seperate from the message board and a thread started on the board to answer questions.

The same goes for the great buildings and lots that are submitted. GrampaAl has done a good job explaining, but then too I get cross talk about other ways to do it. To a $%&^! or someone who finally decides to delve into adding additional user items it becomes quite a nightmare.

It comes down to the basic question GrampaAl asked, what's up with the Plugins folder. You have GrampaAl making an effort to make it easy, then someone comes along and says this will help, and another who says do it this way. Whew! By the time I get done reading all the post, I am back at the original question, what's up with Plugins folder?

Please, this is NOT knocking anyone, it's meant to show that some people can come away just as confused as when they first found the thread. Especially the noobs. Noobs might someday get the answer and contribute. I say this because I have been around sites where noobs were harrassed enough just so they'd quit.

The slowness of this site is not a problem, but when you are trying to do a search to find the answers, I have wasted more time this way by the way, and so the same basic questions are asked again and again.

I really think there should be some submission rules and a final copy FAQ or How To series for handling all of the submissions. Then, have a thread, maybe called the Newbie Bin, where anyone can post questions to the author or other experts about those FAQ's or How To's.

ST is a huge site and slow and so we get what we get but getting the information for noobs or people who are starting to get into downloadables from here need a once and for all understanding of what to do.

Just my thoughts. Like I say, I'm not knocking anyone here, just wondering about the overall way in which people can be best served with correct and timely information.

[spy360 1]

Does anyone know what program i can use to open the DAT files?

[kuplet 0]

Wait - so let me get this straight. I should create sub-directories in my plugin folder in MyDocs and just place all the lot files there and the bat files should go to the other plugin folder in Program files folder? Is that correct?

Btw, kinda off topic but are the transportation mods any good? How about the graph mods?

[Thunderman 30]

Yeps, That's Right Kuplet!

[qwerty697 2]

First of all I do try to use these guidelines, but I still need a long time to actually finish organizing.  If I know the name of the lot/bat maker I make a folder for them in the my docs plugin folder, then put all their stuff in there, unless they specify otherwise in the readme file.  I find that usally this results in fewer directories.

 

You said that the game lots everything in the plugins folder then it loads the stuff in the subfolders.  It seems to me that making subfolders may actually make the loading slower, since it has to load the folder then all the subfloders, but I could be wrong.

 

What about the CSX bat you said had special properties, do those have to go back to the my docs plugin folder?

[wbelac 0]

I have read this entire thread, but am still confused. Where should I put the .dat, .SC4Lot, .SC4Model, and .SC4Desc files? I use mods, but do not make them, and I have not made any BATs or lots.

Any help will be appreciated.

Wbelac

[GrampaAl 76]

Date:10/26/2004 3:21:51 PM
Author:wbelac

I have read this entire thread, but am still confused. Where should I put the .dat, .SC4Lot, .SC4Model, and .SC4Desc files? I use mods, but do not make them, and I have not made any BATs or lots.

Any help will be appreciated.

Wbelac

quote>

I can understand the confusion.

So first let me say that all .sc4model and .sc4desc files are really BAT objects, and not lots. BAT objects are either Buildings or Props. All of these I recommend placing into the ProgramFiles/Maxis/SimCity4/Plugins directory preferably in a subfolder, but not really critical.

All SC4Lot files are specifially lot files and these I recommend placing in the /MyDocs/SimCity4/Plugins directory path, again in a subfolder is preferred.

.dat files are not specific and can contain any or all of the above files. So you could place these in either plugins directory or subdirectories under them.

Now that sounds stupid eh! Well, it is really a rather technical issue, which is really more important to the serious gamer or the custom content maker.

To really place these files correctly to avoid most of the common problems you need to understand the contents of the .dat files, and why you want to place them in one subfolder or the other.

The issue has to do with files overriding each other. All files in the Maxis plugin directory structure have the capability of overriding the main files that come with the game. This is what gives us the capability of making mods that change the way the game behaves.

Any files in the MyDocs plugin directory structure have the capability to override the settings of ALL previously loaded files, including the mods themselves. So if you are making lots that may act as mods, those need to load last and therefore need to be in the MyDocs path.

I hope this has helped clarified the issue.

Look at some of the posts and pictures above and you will get a better idea of how some others have arranged theirs.

You could just ignore all of this and place everything into the MyDocs/SimCity4/Plugins directory. If you do however, and then decide to use the Lot editor, or the BAT tool, or the PlugInManager tool (PIM) then having everything in the one folder will really confuse you and also not enable you to do troubleshooting if you should need to. If you only play the game it won't make a significant difference.

[wbelac 0]

I just was reading a topic, and came across the suggestion to merge plugin files into .dats using File2DAT. This makes sense to me that it would speed up SimCity, as there would be less files to load. Should I do this?

Any thoughts??

wbelac

[GrampaAl 76]

If you are a creator of custom content, and when finished you have a variety of Props, lots and/or Bat files along with the .sc4desc files that go with them and you plan on releasing something new and unique, then by all means go ahead and place them all into single .dat file if you wish.

 

However, if you are talking about other peoples custom content, DO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT.

 

You see as we all learn more and more, we have a tendency to go back and upgrade our content. So if you find an upgraded lot or prop set, how will you know how to get rid of your old stuff. So, what ever you download, leave it in it's original form.

 

You may place into custom folders to help you find it later or keep you files and content organized, but keep the original name of the files you downloaded, so you can at least search for them and find them, should you wish to remove them and replace them with new and better files in the future.

[wbelac 0]

Thanks, GrandpaAl, for all of your help.

Wbelac

[mark_findlay 0]

No offense to anyone. KISS (keep it simple stupid)
this thread has made me want to go take a nap.

Question: Once installed how do i use DL items.
Question: Some work, some dont, where do the appear in the game.

Thankyou