Abandonment due to commute time

[fabsies55 5]

ok, heres hopefully... the last and final question for this thread, that will answer the initial problem at the start... hopefully...

scenario, im new to simcity, and im going to build my first city, what steps should i take to build a thriving city that easily manages and does not create any abandonment at all etc, etc

so like, 1) keep all highways simple, straight, not many curves to reduce traffic times

2) make sure you start slow with development

3) put subways on each corner

sort of stuff? it will be interesting to see what people come up with

[z1 566]

1) keep all highways simple, straight, not many curves to reduce traffic times

This isn't really necessary if you use the NAM traffic simulator, which comes with the NAM. But if you want to avoid abandonment in any but the smallest cities, the NAM traffic simulator is a necessity.

3) put subways on each corner

This will help a lot; most people don't realize how much extensive subway use can ease traffic flow and help avoid abandonment issues.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

The question of a small city is always intriguing. One of the tricks is to control the high-density buildings. Simply don't zone any, but if you must, use taxes to control the abundance of them. Starting with the neutral tax rate at the beginning, you can step up taxes on $$$ types to either slow them down or shut them out depending on how you feel about it.

Whether the initial expense of a subway is justified is moot.

[fabsies55 5]

so here im posting three photos of a city im working on, its hard to see my transportation network due to the trees but i need help identifying what's wrong? somehow my commute is long, even though i have lots of bus stops and subway networks... did i start developing too quickly? or is my system too complex and not... straight enough, should i just simply focus on a grid system and nothing else?

<p>

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Your images seem to be absent.

[z1 566]

Commute times are unreliable. If the rest of your city is working OK, don't worry about them.

[fabsies55 5]

Your images seem to be absent.

ok, there are the photo's, with that transport system, i still get abandonment, its hard to see, but i do have subway in quite a few spots

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Don't see any abandoned (shaded) buildings. If you plop a lot of buildings expect trouble as the system tries to settle down after you do that. You should probably wait about six sim-months for things to settle.

[fabsies55 5]

it hasn't worked, i keep getting abandonment, i can show a photo now if i need too, but i am getting a fair bit...

[Mister Giggles 310]

Hmm...

If subway connections are amble, and there's still a lot of abandonment, then the following is likely:

You're plum out of jobs for whichever residential occupant type is abandoning. Now this is tricky, since if this is anything other than your first city, the RCI cannot accurately tell you which one is out of jobs.

But The Census Repository can! Install it, then read the instructions. But if you want to be lazy, take a look at this image. The information you're looking for is in the "City" and "Drives" columns.

The City column shows you the amount of each occupancy type you have in the city.

The Drives column shows the innate amount of an occupancy type your city can hold. They do not take into consideration regional demand, only the amounts of jobs and residents the city can optimally hold by itself.

What I'm willing to bet, at this stage, is that one of the Residentials is over the Drives number. Or, in a less likely scenario, your city's jobs are being eaten up by a neighbor's (Although ignore the "Commuters from SimNation" number; it displays POSSIBLE commuters, not actual). In that case, start checking your neighbor connections and see who's coming in...

  Edited July 9, 2012 by Mister Giggles  

[fabsies55 5]

so, lets say, i have not enough jobs for my high wealth sims, what am i trying to zone so that there is? what annoys me about the game, is you can't make realistic cities, as where in real life, there can be sometimes many many blocks of residential before there is an abundance of commercial with lots of lights and swervy roads... you can't really do that in this game -__-

[Mister Giggles 310]

NAM makes realistic cities far more possible, through subways are still ideal for "encouraging" the game to actually care about long distances between house and work.

This explains the percentage of R$$$ who will work in a building of a given wealth type. If you suddenly get the feeling SC4 is becoming less about gaming and more about math, there's a reason for that...

[fabsies55 5]

ok... i found out, that i actually have an abundance in CO$$$ and i have extremely low everything else, and its wierd, because i have alot of R$$ residents, infact more than half my residents are R$$ somehow... and no CO$$ or CS$$ jobs... so how do i try and get more CO$$ or CS$$ jobs?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Education of the masses. Do you have colleges or the University?

[Ro-Bo 183]

65% of CO$$$ works is allocated for R$$. Only 15% for R$$$.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Quite true. Don't forget the good old business hierarchy. The higher, the fewer.

[fabsies55 5]

i have only a few colleges and 1 university...

heres a screen shot of my city stats...

[z1 566]

One thing that strikes me right off is that your tax rates are just a smidgen too high. The neutral tax rate for your population is 8.9% You should knock down all your tax rates to this rate. I'm willing to bet that this will help.

[Mister Giggles 310]

Your city has an abundance of jobs for everyone in it, Fabsies. Have you implemented a copious amount of subways? Though your city isn't near so complex as to need that, I'd think.

Have you checked desirability? If that's bad, then traffic isn't the problem...

[fabsies55 5]

desirability is amazing, the correct development isnt lol

[fabsies55 5]

One thing that strikes me right off is that your tax rates are just a smidgen too high. The neutral tax rate for your population is 8.9% You should knock down all your tax rates to this rate. I'm willing to bet that this will help.

didn't work... keep getting abandonment

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Depending on the age of the city and the income level, try lowering taxes across the board.

If your city is more than four (4) years old, set the ID tax to 20% to harvest and slowly eliminate ID.

If you are making a good profit per month, try dropping taxes by 0.2%, and if profit taking continues at more than around 2,000 per month try another similar drop.

Oh, and I initially set my farm tax rate to 7% right off the top. This is just my Ag subsidy.

Now, as to abandonment, it is possible the zoning is hyperthyroidic. At that population, you still have to be careful with high-density zoning unless you are shooting for R$ tenements (in an underprivileged area).

I have an abandonment policy. If a building abandons, I rezone it at a lower level or switch from R to C depending on circumstances.

[fabsies55 5]

from those stats that i have given... infact its significantly changed so far... i have a good move of all types of residents... and way too much CO$$$ and not enough CO$$, CO$ and CS$$,

im getting abandonment across the board... in all three residential types, low medium and high wealth... im going try and start my city all over again, destroy all the zones and most of the roads and try to change everything to a direct route... see how that works out for me...

[fabsies55 5]

any ideas on how to actually get lower wealth things to grow?

[z1 566]

any ideas on how to actually get lower wealth things to grow?

Don't build many educational, health, or civic facilities, and place your Sims next to industrial zones. Do what you can to encourage pollution. Don't bulldoze dilapidated or abandoned buildings.

Of course if you go overboard here, your city will just plain abandon. Or burn down.

  Edited July 13, 2012 by z1  

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

It is a balancing act. Best way to attract R$ is to put them where the desirability zones are negative for R$$ and R$$$. Don't be shy about zoning some 4 x 2 high density lots right next to your ID. Usually grows tenements for R$, especially those that can't afford cars.

[z1 566]

Another thing you can do is power your city exclusively with waste-to-energy plants, if possible - they're the biggest polluters in the standard SC4. Then zone residential all around them. Or better yet, plop them singly in the middle of residential areas. The R$ Sims will love it. The R$$ and R$$$ Sims - not so much. (Not at all, actually.)

[fabsies55 5]

any ideas on how to actually get lower wealth things to grow?

Don't build many educational, health, or civic facilities, and place your Sims next to industrial zones. Do what you can to encourage pollution. Don't bulldoze dilapidated or abandoned buildings.

Of course if you go overboard here, your city will just plain abandon. Or burn down.

It is a balancing act. Best way to attract R$ is to put them where the desirability zones are negative for R$$ and R$$$. Don't be shy about zoning some 4 x 2 high density lots right next to your ID. Usually grows tenements for R$, especially those that can't afford cars.

Another thing you can do is power your city exclusively with waste-to-energy plants, if possible - they're the biggest polluters in the standard SC4. Then zone residential all around them. Or better yet, plop them singly in the middle of residential areas. The R$ Sims will love it. The R$$ and R$$$ Sims - not so much. (Not at all, actually.)

thing is... i dont need R$ or R$$, i need CO$$ CS$$ and CS$ lol... but ill give the... less education thing a go...

[z1 566]

thing is... i dont need R$ or R$$, i need CO$$ CS$$ and CS$ lol... but ill give the... less education thing a go...

Understood. But heavily weighting your population toward R$ is a good way to generate demand for lower-wealth commercial buildings. And many of the things that encourage a R$ bias, such as lack of parks and more pollution, also encourage a lower-wealth commercial bias as well.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Don't kid yourself about not needing $ level Sims. Who takes out the trash? Who sweeps floors? Who pushes the coffee wagon? All those nice high $ buildings you want employ more $ than $$$. The business hierarchy is in effect. The higher the fewer.