Day Night Cycle

[nivao 0]

 Hi there,

It has been some time since I've been active here, but I'm back (for now). I've just installed BAT4Max which now works properly with my 3DS Max 2011 (the previous version didn't).

But I have a question that apparently hasn't been answered yet (I've searched around): as mentioned in the BAT4Max thread, using truNite to export day and night models separately (to avoid errors with the original export) you will get a 'jump' from the day to night model . I really don't like that 'jump', is there a way to keep that effect to a minimum or avoid it entirely?

[SimFox 804]

Keep "effect" to the minimum? What do you mean?

[nivao 0]

The game uses a gradient to control the colors during the day/night cycle, right (it's called color grading)? Then make the difference between the gradient and the night model as small as possible so that the day model will have a color similar to that of the night model.

Do you get it?

[SimFox 804]

I get it, if by "it" you mean game mechanics. Real one, as opposed of imaginary. Which, I have a feeling, you don't get...

First off all something may be called gradient and even color gradient but it certainly not what game uses. Game creates night out of day with color overlay - look it up it is something quite different that gradient. That applies only to No-Night Lighting Content. For that special pre-rendered night views are superimposed on top of that Day + color overlay combo. That how game works. And it works exactly the same way for all content. With NO exception, be it default one or truNite one.

Second how do you imagine "making the difference" as little as possible? For starters difference between "gradient" and the model? I assume you mean the pre-rendered images of a night view of the model and the overlay. Anyway whatever way you put it it makes no sense what-so-ever. How do you imagine making such a difference as small as possible. I mean difference between solid flat color and rendered image of a model. Do you at all understand what constitutes this "difference"?

Anyway TruNite differs from original night views only by a simple fact that it uses Mask covering entire model - like in a day view, as opposed of typically partial one. So with the original method you see day view of the building tinted by color overlay and on top of this you have masked areas that are affected by either nitelites or NightWindows. This is what allows for the dask/dawn transition. You see how game changes color overlay while masked lit areas remain (in a dusk case) on TOP of this. Problem is that with this method it is impossible to create high quality night views. It is not a matter of skill, it is impossible by a technology used! Here is an illustration of said technology failure:

and

Here is same images with hue component removed:

and

I think it is very informative and illustrative.

Apart of that there is no way to take in account thins like bounced light, reflections and many more... and you last suggestion makes no sense anyway.

The only way I can think of to minimize transition problem would be to make day/night transition in game a more, or altogether sudden one... That is doable.

[nivao 0]

Never mind. I think I'm a little confused now but one more thing. Several buildings on the STEX don't have that sudden switch so I assume that those are made with the same method as Gmax? By exporting day and night in a single export instead of the truNite method?

EDIT: BTW Color grading means using a color map (a plain full screen color) as overlay on top of the game view.

[Jasoncw 11,949]

Here is the order of the layers in the game, which can't be changed:

Nitelites

Blue tint

full day render

With traditional nitelighting, the only stuff on the nitelites layer are the areas of the building that are directly effected by the nitelites, with everything else masked out.  So if at night there is only one window lit up, the nitelites layer will literally just be that one lit up window, with everything else masked out.  Because of this, the blue tint layer and the day layer show through.

With trunite, a full building night render is done, and the alpha mask encompasses the entire building.  This means that the night layer is covering up the blue tint layer and the day layer.  The blue tint layer is responsible for the day/night transition, but it's being covered up.  You can't see the tint layer changing colors because it's actually behind the night render layer.  But it does blend in well when it's fully night time, but that's because the bat4max lighting rig was designed to match what Day+Blue Tint looks like, not because it's actually affected in any way by the blue tint.

So to make a long story short, trunite and the night/day cycle are inheritly uncompatible.  But luckily very few people play the game with the night/day transition, and trunite is a huge improvement over traditional night lighting except for that, so I think it's worthwhile.

[nivao 0]

Yeah, a lot of people don't use the day/nigh cycle, that's true. I just wanted to have custom lots that can match with the original SC4 lots, but no matter, I think I will ignore this topic and just create everything like everyone else does: using truNite.