The Official Global Warming/Climate Change Thread

[AcmeSigns 97]

If the planet so decides she'll shrug us off like the gnats we are. And the planet will go on. It's just us humans that might not.

 

The planet was once roamed by dinosaurs. Seen any lately? Oh wait...I forgot...there are probably those who believe they were killed off by humankind's greenhouse gas emissions.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

If the planet so decides she'll shrug us off like the gnats we are. And the planet will go on. It's just us humans that might not.

 

The planet was once roamed by dinosaurs. Seen any lately? Oh wait...I forgot...there are probably those who believe they were killed off by humankind's greenhouse gas emissions.

Nah!  The dinosaurs are still with us.  Velociraptors became turkeys.  Other birds and reptiles are direct descendents.  Isn't evolution wonderful!?

[AcmeSigns 97]

Well, I know for a fact that our chickens are nothing more than downsized dinosaurs, but I was referring to the big-uns. Them I don't see so much any more.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Well, I know for a fact that our chickens are nothing more than downsized dinosaurs, but I was referring to the big-uns. Them I don't see so much any more.

The best story going around is that they died in the Yucatan meteor strike catastrophe, but clearly not all of them.  Seems many of the smaller ones survived to become birds, etc.  Evolution does stranger things, like skipping over some insect species that are pretty much the same as they were from that time.  We'll maybe have a clearer picture when we see what emerges (as fossils) from the permafrost as it melts and release all that methane.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

NOAA publishes heat records in May, June 2014.

 

This is not exactly anecdotal.  There is too much evidence for deniers to continue on a futile track.  The going is getting tough, so it is time for the tough to get going.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

There's an ocean up there.

 

Major ocean waves in the Arctic Ocean for the first time in our recorded history.  Seems like the Northwest passage will be rough.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

The earth has had higher temperatures before but as long as plants have existed, has never had carbon dioxide concentrations higher than 500 ppm. Mass extinctions happened during those tumultuous times.

--Ocram

  Edited August 2, 2014 by OcramSeattle  

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Higher than 500 what?  Parts per ?

[Ocram's Razr 964]

Sorry, 500ppm of Carbon Dioxide in the atmosphere. At least I did not just say "there will soon be over 500_ carbon in the air," which I have seen some people quoted in magazines and the internet. The accurate way to say it is by the middle of the century, there may soon be approximately 700 parts per million of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.

 

--Ocram

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

It may be true, but as global warming really kicked in, I'd be a lot more worried about methane from the permafrost and the deep oceans.  Nature has its own way of gassing things up.

 

You may even be around for this one, but hopefully, I will have left the scene by then.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

A Brief Reprieve.

 

A pause as one cycle interferes with another.  A little breathing room for us to get our act together.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Pacific Methane Vents discovered

 

 

Researchers say they have found more than 500 bubbling methane vents on the seafloor off the US east coast.

 

The unexpected discovery indicates there are large volumes of the gas contained in a type of sludgy ice called methane hydrate.

 

Forget Carbon Dioxide, this is much, much worse.  The ocean is now warm enough for this.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

These people are members of the 'New York 400' and are richer than the average country.

 

While this fund isn't a lot, there are other investment trusts associated with 'big oil' that, if run though the divest/invest program could make a serious difference in the greening of transportation around the world.  If we just stopped using petroleum for fuel, we'd be cleaner and have a lot more of it to covert into more useful products than combustion products.  I figure this will take about a century, so we'd better get going.

[Odainsaker 2,136]

NASA released a fascinating video showing a year's worth of atmospheric CO₂ patterns from 2006:

 

And here is a companion video suggesting our potential doom, showing CO₂ increases, both directly measured for the anomalous modern era spike, and derived from ice core samples tracing glacial and interglacial cycles back 800,000 years:

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Fascinating.  Note that this is a model from old collected data nearly a decade out of date.  Since they have these satellites specialized for this observation, what is there that is more recent?

 

The most virulent concentrations of CO₂ appear during the winter months.  Who is surprised?  Heating clearly emits more gas than automotive travel if you can rely on this model.

 

For all the screaming done about human emissions, we are also in a warming geologic cycle which people seem to forget.  While looking at a few fallen leaves, we should not omit viewing the forest.

 

Also, let's not forget that life as we know it is Carbon based.

[Duke87 1,070]

The winter/summer discrepancy (mostly) isn't because of building heating putting more carbon dioxide in the air in winter. It's because plants stop taking it out of the air via photosynthesis. This cycle is natural and has been occurring since before there were people. What is not so natural is the peak concentrations being higher year after year rather than things just cycling back to where they started.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Depends on what you call natural.  The presence of the homo sapiens species is unnatural?  We are evolved just like everything else, so why claim some uniqueness?

[Bdub01 201]

I

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

From snow heavy roof structures to wet snow.

 

This is only the first such storm of the winter.  The city of Buffalo, NY is essentially paralysed and they are getting state and federal(?) aid.  They have a pretty good snow removal system in that city, but if this goes on ...

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

And in the British Isles ...

 

One wonders what the effects of rising sea levels will be on other island nations and those with large coastal areas?  The Dutch are good at holding off the sea, but will the changing climate finally undo the polders?  Iceland?  Greenland (Denmark)? North America?  Particularly Florida and Lousiana?  Galveston, TX?

[BLANKBLANK 4,414]

Whatever climate changes happen the UK will cope, we've got the money to cope.

 

If people really care about "carbon emissions" <spitwad> then we would stop eating meat, stop using plastic products and with it most clothes. Oh wait, we're so dependant on plastics -- and the few thousand untested chemicals which have probably done more damage than manmade emissions ever will, I'm thinking male infertility and phthalates  -- that we can't live modern life without them.

 

Oh yeah, this beloved "green" technology? Solar panels, wind turbines, electric cars, computers and energy-efficient devices? All made from rare earth elements/metals. And they ain't called rare earth for nothing you know. It involves mining a few million tonnes of earth or rock to obtain a few meagre kilogrammes, or even less. So aside from massive strip-mining, there is both horrendous chemical and water pollution produced in the processes to preserve and refine these rare earth elements, since rare earth elements have the unfortunate habit of corroding and/or disintegrating in Earth's atmosphere. One last thing- this is incredibly energy intensive.

 

These green technologies ain't so green. And to make all these green products to prevent "man-made global warming" will involve ramping up production by probably a thousand times at least. Rare earth extraction is going to boom, so will stripmines and chemical processing- the kind which can devastate vast swaths of countryside.

[Ocram's Razr 964]

There are various technologies and fuel sources that could already be used (since they have already been invented) but are not being used because of public opinion controlled by big oil and some environmentalists. Generation IV Nuclear Power Plants are safe and powerful and the only way to make a hydrogen economy feasible (though the sulfur-iodine channel). Algae could be utilized to produce ojos more efficiently than other sources. I have seen healthy salad oil produced from algae sold in supermarkets for the past couple years. One problem is that it is slightly more economical to feed algae sugar than for them to grow with carbon dioxide and sunlight. Batteries currently use lithium, which needs to be extracted from special salt flats, mines, or ocean water. Car batteries could be replaced with graphene or hemp supercapacitors. Also, in places with a lot of sun or cold places with frequent sunny days, would be better off using concentrated solar arrays that utilize heat engines (usually Stirling) better than photovoltaic panels.

--Ocram

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

It is not political to desert the oil companies, the lobbies are far too powerfully embedded.  We are hoist on our own petard, and every time you start the engine in your gas buggy you are voting for the status quo, even though that quo has long lost its status.

 

The only way to put the boots to the gasoline trade is to stop buying it.  Any volunteers?

[Ocram's Razr 964]

FYI, I don't drive. Nor do I often take a taxi or ask to be driven around.

--Ocram

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Well, good for you.  Do you bicycle or just walk?

[Ocram's Razr 964]

Depending on how easy it is to get from point A to point B, I either walk or use mass transit.

--Ocram

[blade2k5 1,523]

Whatever climate changes happen the UK will cope, we've got the money to cope.

 

If people really care about "carbon emissions" <spitwad> then we would stop eating meat, stop using plastic products and with it most clothes. Oh wait, we're so dependant on plastics -- and the few thousand untested chemicals which have probably done more damage than manmade emissions ever will, I'm thinking male infertility and phthalates  -- that we can't live modern life without them.

 

Oh yeah, this beloved "green" technology? Solar panels, wind turbines, electric cars, computers and energy-efficient devices? All made from rare earth elements/metals. And they ain't called rare earth for nothing you know. It involves mining a few million tonnes of earth or rock to obtain a few meagre kilogrammes, or even less. So aside from massive strip-mining, there is both horrendous chemical and water pollution produced in the processes to preserve and refine these rare earth elements, since rare earth elements have the unfortunate habit of corroding and/or disintegrating in Earth's atmosphere. One last thing- this is incredibly energy intensive.

 

These green technologies ain't so green. And to make all these green products to prevent "man-made global warming" will involve ramping up production by probably a thousand times at least. Rare earth extraction is going to boom, so will stripmines and chemical processing- the kind which can devastate vast swaths of countryside.

 

 

I'll never stop eating meat no matter how loud some may scream against it.  I do what I want and don't give bleep what other people think.  That's their issue and they need to get over it and move along.

 

Now, as for today's balmy weather, it's currently colder outside than a freezer and I have people wanting me to shovel snow today.  Know what I told them?  Do it yourself as you're not paying me enough to work outside in conditions like this.  It's around -15F with wind chills approaching -30-40F.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

H. Sap. is an omnivore.  We are not designed for a vegetarian diet, and it is a good way to put an end to the whole species.  Eat what you please, you will anyway.  I agree with Blade2K5, outfits like PETA give me a cafard. Everyone should join my counter organization "People Eating Tasty Animals".

 

And we don't call this cold in the frozen north.  Shovel snow?  If I do, where will all those recent refugees we've let in find work?

 

Currently it is -15C (+5F) with an expected high of -14 all day.  We have snow squall and wind warnings over the whole area and most places are closed because of all the snow.

[A Nonny Moose 8,262]

Interesting photos.

 

The bubbles are Methane, folks.  As greenhouse gases go, these have cards and spades over Carbon Dioxide.  There are millions of tonnes of this stuff locked up in the not-so-permafrost.

[Compdude787 916]

Just found this article that states that historical temperature data was manipulated to make it seem like the earth was actually getting warmer when it really hasn't, in an effort to bolster claims about global warming taking place. I never really believed that global warming/ climate change was caused by humans or had anything to do with increasing CO₂ concentrations in the atmosphere, but now I have further proof that this global warming is a complete utter farce.