SPAs Urbanist BAT Thread

[Kwakelaar 92]

Sorry about the lowering of the roof, I did not look properly, otherwise I would have seen that it is not very simpel to lower the roof on this model.

Dark or light they both look excellent.

[spa 970]

No need to apologise Kwakelaar. Your advice has been invaluable as I have moved along. It's just when it came to the roof, it seemed like a minor detail given that the cost would mean modifying almost every object and there are more than the normal number on this model since the walls aren't one solid piece. Please don't hesitate to voice any observations.

[spa 970]

Well I just got back from a three day trip to Edmonton and it has been a while since I have posted so it seems to be time for an update. As those who have been following my thread know, I'm planning on releasing my Canadian bank branches as a set all at once. This means that I have five branches to complete. I have done a fair bit of work on the set already and three of the five are nearly complete. Over the last week I have started the fourth and I have fine tuned several textures (mainly to add gradients) on my other three. Here's where things sit as of this evening on all five branches.

 

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http://img502.imageshack.us/img502/1294/royalbankstatusreport5ui.jpg align=baseline>

 

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http://img240.imageshack.us/img240/5324/scotiabankstatusreport6vi.jpg align=baseline>

 

Since my Scotia Bank is new I'll tell you about the real building. The real Scotia Bank branch that I'm basing this on is located at the intersection of Robie Street, Spring Garden Road and Coburg Road in Halifax. It's an unusual building, but as far as I know it has always been a bank branch. Since the closure of the CIBC across the street from the University of Kings College campus a few years ago, this Scotia Bank has become the nearest bank branch to the large student population at Dalhousie University. That said, unlike the other branches I have featured, this Scotia Bank isn't located in the midst of a major shopping area. Check out the picture below.

 

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/3879/scotiabankreallife3xi.jpg align=baseline>

 

Isn't that a unique building? If you look at my model and squint closely you can see that I have included the stonework on the roof outline. It took a while to do and a good chunk of the detail I put in isn't visible in the render, but there is a hint of it and hey it's the little details that that counts right? As always comments are welcome.

[Kwakelaar 92]

I think these are all very well done so far.

Only thing I would suggest is to think about making some of them w2w for smaller downtown areas.

The last bank building I would have thought it be some kind of church or something, nice building tough.

[jacqulina 162]

great work

[profecy 2]

very well done spa, cant wait till they released so i can put dem to good use, in a Canadian city

[spa 970]

Kwakelaar: What do you mean by make them w2w? It is my understanding that w2w is just older European style buidings. Is there something specific about w2w? Indeed I too thought the Scotia Bank might have once been a church. All Saints Cathedral is actually right across the street on the other side of a little square from the bank. However, if it building was once a church, it has been really heavily modified since inside there is no sign of any churck like features. I'm afraid I just don't know the buildings origin. Thank you as always for your valuable feedback.

 

Jacqulina: Thanks for the comment and encouragement. Good to know you approve of my work.

 

Profecy: I have been following your Toronto journal and I'm looking forward to seeing my bank branches put to use in it. I have thought that Jersey Devil's might also pick them up for his Edmonton recreation. It would be neat to be featured in the two top Canadian recreations. As things stand, I'll probably be releasing all five branches sometime in early April or late March depending on how things go.

[ElBarto92 7]

You know, I always thought that that's what w2w meant, too, but I've seen buildings not in that style be called w2w as well. So - I think I just made a personal discovery - could it mean Wall To Wall?

[spa 970]

Date: 2/24/2006 4:26:18 PM Author: ElBarto92 You know, I always thought that that's what w2w meant, too, but I've seen buildings not in that style be called w2w as well. So - I think I just made a personal discovery - could it mean Wall To Wall?

You know what you're probably right! It seems so obvious now. My misunderstanding was only made worse by the fact that I thought w2w, being European, was also making reference to pre-World War Two European cities. Glad to have that misconception cleaned up. So Kwakelaar, making them w2w isn't a bad idea. I don't think I want to tamper with the proportions in the ones I have made but I think I'll make my Royal Bank fit snug. The building I'm modelling it after would look good tight against other buildings.

[spa 970]

Just a small update.

 

As you can see, I put the top roof balcony decoration on. It doesn't look like much, but it took a lot of doing since the secondary posts aren't solid rectangles. They're actually made up of two rectangles and several modified spline lathes. Making them was complicated and then setting up all the angles and getting them into the right spot was tough too. Again a lot of work slaving over detail that you have to squint to actually see  

 

Anyway, parts of the Scotia Bank are definitely complicated. I still have to make a custom texture for the top roof level floor, but I can't do that until I put the tower on (I'm going to make it dark around the edges, but I can't do that until there are both outside and inside edges). Should have the roof bit finished up this weekend. I'll probably have another update tomorrow.

[spa 970]

Accidental Extra Post!

[spa 970]

Well first off welcome back everyone. I sure missed checking in at Simtropolis this past week. Hopefully we'll have the STEX up soon and when it does go up it should be great since they'll be some saved up projects just waiting for release. Anyway, just because Simtropolis was shut down doesn't mean I was inactive. I still haven't started my Royal Bank branch, but the Scotiabank branch I started over a week ago has sped right along, despite the complexity. Here's where things sit right now

In GMAX



In Game



As you can see, as usual, you can recognize the building from the original, but I took liberties. In this case I added a back wing onto the building so that the BAT would properly fit on a 2x2. I also decided against making this a corner lot because I find that corner lots tend not to get much use. I already have a few potential future bats that will be corner lots and I don't want to only ever see my content popping up on rare occassion. There is still work to be done of course. I'm going to make a second entrance in the indented area, I need windows on the office wing and it needs a roof. None of that is too major and just requires time. I should have this one at the same almost finished state as my other three this week. Then it'll be time to start the Royal. Unless I run into some kind of show stopper, expect my Canadian Bank set to become my first STEX release later this month.

[spa 970]

Well in between working on my MA thesis I found the time to finish up the Scotiabank. It is now in the same state as my other three. The modelling is done and all it needs is nite lighting, some roof junk and in game testing. Below is how things look.

 

I don't know what I'm going to do with the lot yet or anything, but I was thinking that the parking lot I put out front will probably stay. So with the Scotiabank done, it's time for a preview of the last bank branch I need to complete for my set: the Royal Bank. Below is the picture of the Royal Bank branch I'm going to be basing my BAT on.



This RBC branch is located at the corner of Quinpool Road and Oxford Street. It is actually just diagonally across the street from the BMO branch I have already done. As you can see, the RBC branch I'm using fits the pattern of many bank branches.... the first floor is the eqiuvalent of almost two storeys. Just look at the Chinese restaurant next door for comparison. This model isn't as complicated as the Scotiabank, but nor is it simple given all the brick/stone work. All and all though it should take a little less time (I don't plan on doing the ivy). So I should have this started and in shape for a preliminary update in a few days.

[Kwakelaar 92]

The Scotia bank looks excellent, great how you have made the small tower with the metal thingy on the top. You might start considering adding some (more?) gradients to your textures. I think the rooftexture is good but the wall texture looks very clean. This is a charming building, and you might even think about making it into someting else, like a small chapel or a gardenpavillion as an extra download, I would really like to use it for something like that. Still all your decision. W2w is indeed not only restricted to European pre-war buildings.

[spa 970]

Originally posted by: Kwakelaar

The Scotia bank looks excellent, great how you have made the small tower with the metal thingy on the top.
You might start considering adding some (more?) gradients to your textures. I think the rooftexture is good but the wall texture looks very clean.
This is a charming building, and you might even think about making it into someting else, like a small chapel or a gardenpavillion as an extra download, I would really like to use it for something like that. Still all your decision.

W2w is indeed not only restricted to European pre-war buildings.quote>

Kwakelaar: I'm glad you like it. It took a long time to get this one to this point. The tower was quite difficult, espeically the little tower's roof. There actually is a gradient on the wall, but it's rather faint. I'll turn it up a notch so that it's more noticeable. When I'm done the bank set, perhaps as an add on to the Scotiabank download I'll make it into one of the buildings that you suggest. I'm happy to do so. You've been so helpful during the batting process. The only question is which would you prefer? A pavillion or a chapel? I have some ideas about how I could make it "churchy" so unless you would rather have a pavillion I'll probably go that root. Thanks for your comment.

[spa 970]

Just a quick note and picture of my latest render. I started the Royal Bank yesterday and have been picking at it ever since. Here is what the model currently looks like.



Lots of work still to be done. I'm not entirely satisfied with the brick texture I have on it, the decorative detail around the windows needs to be brought out with a stronger texture and the opacity settings on the windows still need to be adjusted. Each window is actually a different texture with a different reflection on it, but unfortunately that doesn't seem to be showing up well. Anyway, if I have time today or tomorrow I'll probably finish the stone work that is between the windows and the roof. Once I know by how much the stone decorative pieces will overhang, I'll be able to set the front wall accordingly and make a fairly tight w2w building. As always, comments are welcome.

[Kwakelaar 92]

A chapel would of course be great. The new model seems to be going very nicely. If it becomes to big for a 1x1 lot you can always change the size of the model in the IliveReader (and I think also in the LE), or you can make the LODs that fit the walls and have the overhangs on the outside, and it should fit perfectly in a w2w environment.

[cogeo 960]

Not only they look great , these small/medium-size buildings are very usefull as well. I really appreciate that some people make such buildings (they will grow at some early-to-medium stage, I suppose), you can start your city in style (and not just use the indifferent ingame buildings), or instead you can make a good looking lowrise area.
I'm not a BAT expert (so I can't provide more detailed commenting), but they all look very beatiful to me, and can't wait to see them on the STEX.

[spa 970]

Kwakelaar: Good to know that their are work around solutions if a building gets too big. That might very well come to the rescue for me someday since my primary interest is small commercials so I'll no doubt have more w2ws as time goes on. On the Royal, it actually hasn't been an issue because I knew where I was going from the beginning (things usually go much smoother with a plan eh).

Cogeo: I'm glad you like my work. Thanks for the nice comment. It's nice to know that people do appreciate the small buildings and it's not all about skyscrappers. I started into small buildings because I like to make mixed low rise residental/shopping streets and I got sick and tired of seeing Chung Curreny Exchange, Chalmers, Kobyaski Accountants and the other 10 or so small Maxis commercial service buildings that grow like weeds in these areas. A couple of the British BAT artists (rp2000, tonkso and gascooker) have done some good work to expand our options for commercial services, but it's still an area of the STEX that I think could do with more attention. As for not being a BAT expert, your thread would seem to indicate otherwise


One general note for everyone, over the last two days I have been putting in a lot of time (too much really considering I have thesis that needs to be written) and the result is that the Royal Bank, after some severe headaches with the stone work, is very close to being finalized. I'll probably have an update featuring it either late tonight or tomorrow. Then it'll be just a matter of taking care of the odds and ends that I have left on my four previous BATs (roof junk, lighting and testing). The STEX, and my first mass release, isn't far away now. How exciting.

[spa 970]

So I have the Royal Bank Branch to the point where it's time for a post. Below are the pictures.


Front

Right Side (the Left Side is the same except it has more windows instead of the Royal's Lion logo)
 
Back

So all and all I'm pleased with how it turned out. It fits on a 2x3 snugly, even with the decorative overhangs. Those overhangs turned out to be a real pain because when I brought the different wall pieces together I found they didn't fit each other. That was a lot of fun figuring out where I had screwed up and which dimensions needed to be changed given the number of pieces involved. The only thing I'm really not sure about is whether or not I should add a second floor. On one hand, being a bank, the first floor is already almost as tall as two normal floors and I'm not sure the decorative overhangs would have the same effect if there were two rows instead of just one. But, on the other hand, most w2w buildings in real life are in dense areas where most buildings are at least two storeys. This BAT is flexible in that it has detail on the sides so it'll look fine if there isn't a building smack up against it, but it'll also fit snugly if there is so I really don't know.

One funny thing, while I was working on this very branch on Saturday night, the Royal Bank two doors up from me was broken into. I'm not sure if they lost any money but the Brinks truck eventually turned up so I suspect, given the late hour, that someone broke into the bank machine. It was quite a scramble for the Calgary police.

Anyway, unless I'm going to be putting a second floor on the Royal (even if I do that shouldn't take more than a couple of hours) I'm pretty much ready to do the roof junk, put in the night lighting and do the game testing. I have a busy two weeks with school so it'll probably go slower than it otherwise would, but I should still be on track for a release at the end of the month. As always comments and feedback are welcome.

[Kwakelaar 92]

This is excellent work!!

[spa 970]

Thanks as always Kwakelaar for the support! I'm also pretty pleased with the way the Royal turned out and I think I'll probably leave it as is and not add a second floor.

Well my life is busy right now with school. I just got home about half an hour ago after spending the entire day at the university (10 hours in the Lab and you start to go a little stir crazy). It's looking like a busy week too. I have a presentation on Tuesday, a book review and presentation on Thursday and a term paper due on Monday and a presentation of said term paper on the Thursday. So I'm fairly occupied for the next 10 or so days. I did find some down time to do some tinkering around with the BAT, but it wasn't on any of my banks. To finish the banks I need to spend some real time on them to figure out roof junk and lighting (I haven't ever done either before) and I just don't have the energy right now to learn something new. Don't worry though for anyone who has been watching and waiting, I'll finish them once this hellish streatch of schoolwork is over. In the interim, I'm tinkering with BAT just not on anything too challenging. Anyway, here is a picture of the next building up in my continuing small commercial service series:



It's the Ardmore Tea Room from Quinpool Road in Halifax. A word about the Ardmore. The Ardmore is one of those places that has become a local institution. The place is family owned and serves good food on the cheap in a traditional style diner. It has been operating for decades and is quite popular. Notably, when Hurricane Juan hit Halifax in 2003 and knocked out power for days and days (some neighbourhoods had no power for three weeks!) the Ardmore served up a giant BBQ in the Lawtons Drug Store parking lot next door. They fed the neighbourhood for FREE for several days. The only thing that stopped them is they ran out of food. The food would have spoiled had they not gotten rid of it, but they certainly didn't have to give it away for free. A real bunch of local heros. What goes around comes around in the Maritimes too since the community rallied behind the McCormick family when a fire in the kitchen closed the Ardmore for several weeks. Today they're up and running and going strong.

Anyway, this is what I have come up with so far. I'm not sure yet whether it'll be on a 2X1 or on a 2X2, but whichever the case it'll fit snug against neighbouring buildings and it's going to be a corner lot. I'll probably end up making it a 2X2 as I'm trying to keep some consistent sizes in my BATs so they can function together better, but we'll just have to see. As always comments are welcome.

[Glenni 1,445]

pretty nice spa!Anyway i've always wondered why you always render the small progresses of your bats for sc4 all the time.you know can just prewiew in bat to right?

[Kwakelaar 92]

Again it is looking very nice your new building, and about the rendering I also tend to render and try out in game to see the result of textures, nightlights and scale.

[spa 970]

Glenni: I have never really tried out the preview function. I like to render because,  by the time it's ready for a preview I'm usually antsy to see how textures turn out in game and what it'll look like in game next to Maxis buildings. Thanks for pointing out the preview function though. Could be useful if I'm looking to post, but I'm pressed for time (to render without errors I have to move everything out of plugins folder which takes a few minutes because I have got over a gig in there).

Kwakelaar: Thanks! Your sentiments about rendering match mine... although I haven't gotten around to playing with night lighting yet. That'll happen sometime after Monday when my work life returns to normal. Oh and congradulations on the Monestary release. I haven't had a chance to try them out yet but they look like they'll be good and quite useful.

[Jasoncw 11,933]

What I do, is I do a preview render, take a screenshot of it using the print screen key, then I put that in photoshop, use the magic selection to delete the black, and delete the rest of the screenshot using whatever. This is all in a .psd that has a few screenshots of cities at zoom 5. Each building has it's own "folder" (whatever those are called). As you make changes and make previews, you can line them up, and then hide/unhide the top one to make direct comparisons. You can also move the buildings group around the screen, and you can compare it to as many city screenshots as possible. I have one .psd that has half a city in screenshots. To see zoom 4, just zoom out to 50%, and that is zoom 4 (z4 is half of z5).

[spa 970]

Well guys I'm now over the worst of the school crunch. I sent out my paper this morning and now I can go back to picking at the MA thesis in peace. So I have some real leisure time for the first time in about two weeks. It's nice. Anyway, today I started into the nagging things that I have yet to do on my almost complete projects. I got into nightlighting for the first time ever. It went pretty well all and all, but it did take me several hours to get everything fairly straight. Anyway, you can check the now lit up for the night TD Bank below.



As you can see, I listened to Glenni and Jason (thanks for the tips guys) and I learned how useful the preview button really can be. I'm fairly pleased with the result overall. The TD Bank logo signs on the front and back seem to have lit up especially well. The only thing that I'm not so happy about is the disappearing window bars on the back. It's strange the way the disappear apparently at random. They're all instances of each other, they're all located on the exact same place on the Y plane and they all sit in front of identical big windows. I thought the windows might be the problem so I broke the glass into four sections to see if that would change anything but it didn't so I just don't know what's going on there. I'm hoping that the bars aren't showing up right now because this is a low quality preview. Hopefully when I render they'll all be in their proper place. In any case, it's not such a big deal. They appear in the day and for me, that's the most important thing since I hardly ever turn on nightmode. 

Finally, I have Gmax question, for any experts out there that might happen by. Under the parameters window for lights, what exactly are "attentuation parameters" for? What do they do? I couldn't figure it out and since the Simtropolis upgrade, phillipbo's tutorial is no longer available for me to reference. Thanks to anyone who can lend a hand here.

[Kwakelaar 92]

The nightlights look very good, especially the front windows on the ground floor. For nighlights I can't help you.

[spa 970]

Kwakelaar: Thanks as always for your comments. It's too bad you're not too familiar with nightlighting. Your advice has been so great throughout. 

So through tinkering around I have managed to do the lighting on my other buildings. I ended upscrapping the idea of modelling the CIBC's back room because it was extremely difficult to light it. That'll be something that maybe I'll try again as my skill level improves.  Anyway, below are the models in all their lighted glory. I'll be starting into roof junk this weekend. I should be into the final stages of game testing if everything goes well sometime next week.

Bank of Montreal at night. 

CIBC at night. I put lights around the window banks but it really doesn't show up very well. Still, it adds just a hint of detail that I'm content with even if no one else ever notices! I guess that's what being obessive is all about.

The Royal Bank at night. There actually is lighting on the RBC signs, but the dark blue doesn't shows it even worse than the lighting on the CIBC (I tried turning up the magnification and it tends to be one of these it's either blinding or invisibile situations). You can kind of see the impact of the lights on the bank's yellow lion logo. The yellow catches the light a bit better so it's not a total loss.

Finally the Scotiabank. This is the one I'm most pleased with. Since the branch had large entranceways I was able to make the door's have shadows extending out into the night. The lighting on the tower turned out okay, but isn't something I'm totally pleased with. I'll probably leave it as is since it was tough enough given to come up with what I have given that there are about a dozen lights up there and lighting really isn't a big part of my game (I'm lighting these really for others since I go months without ever looking at any of my cities in night view).

Anyway, that's where things sit. I'll make a similar update of all of them in one low quality preview when I'm done with roof junk. On another note, it's great to have the insert image button back as an option in the reply screen!

[spa 970]

Just a small update. I started the roof junk and one of my buildings is ready to be displayed in its final form, barring any suggestions.

This is a medium quality preveiw of the TD Bank (appropriate that its the first done since this is where I started). The roof junk on top is basically modelled off a two storey commercial building across the street from me here in Calgary that seems to have one of everything on it (I can see it all quite clearly since I'm up on the fifth floor of my apartment building).  The HVAC units are York units which I have noticed are quite common and are usually a beige colour. If you look closely on my HVACs, on either side below the top vent is the York logo. If you squint and know what it is your looking at, you can kind of see it.  Barring any major suggestions I'll probably use these HVACs on some of my other models as well as making some variations as I go along. I'm thinking that I should really create a collection of roof junk files that I can just merge into different BATs I make. Anyway, I was thinking I should model one of these for my next roof:

They seem to be quite common so I'll probably whip one up tomorrow. One pointer for anyone, if you're looking for examples of roof junk go onto e-bay and conduct a narrow search for HVAC (limit the search to >$500 otherwise you'll get component pieces for sale). The example photos can be quite useful and a good source of textures. Now this is my first attempt at roof junk so any comments and feedback is quite welcome.