Vatican Affairs and Events

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

The Holy Father appoints a new Chair for the Curia.

 

The overhaul begins with the head of the ruling council of the Church.

 

Tempted to say:

Micks' Master powers up and the Curia spins.

But I figured some Catholics might be offended. I am Catholic, and it wouldn't have bothered me.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

A thinking man's pope.

 

It is about time that the Church got back to basics and stopped worrying about individual "sinners" and "sins".

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

And let's remind the medical fraternity what is in the Oath of Hippocrates.

 

We shouldn't depend on the medical profession to clean up our messes.  There is the morning-after pill and there are condoms.  The Church needs to realize it must not be an instrument of burgeoning population that will eventually starve everyone to death.

[AkemiAzula 280]

If I was the Pope I'd advise people not to get married in the first place... I'd advise half the population to become priests or something. Sounds cleaner than a priest coming to his pulpit, slowly putting on his glasses, clearing his throat, and then speaking gravely to his flock...

 

"Today we shall have a sermon about safe sex"

 

No. I think I'd rather advocate celibacy lol if I was a priest

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

They no play the game, they no make the rules.  I am against St. Augustine's invidious mistake of advocating priestly celibacy.  This bishop was married and had nine children, so he was hardly the right example.

 

Family advice can no more be given by a celibate priest and he can sprout wings and fly.

[AkemiAzula 280]

Well it seems illogical to advise creating families when the world is already stressing its resources so much. No good deed is committed by adding to that stress

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Canonizing successors.

 

I higher form of nepotism?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

The Pope urges the Church to emulate his namesake.

 

There is much accumulated treasure in the Vatican that could be turned into cash (over time) to fund charities.  Why has the Church fallen into the sins of Mammon?  If wood was good enough for Jesus, why does the Church need golden vessels?

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

New Secretary of State.

 

Thought to be a strait arrow.  If so, the bunglers in the Curia had better start updating their CVs.

[Fatherted 129]

Isn't the Vatican state illegal by International Law? Freedom of Religion, Free Speech etc. are all violated by this "Country". I think it should become a private establishment.

[Ocram's Razr 963]

Isn't the Vatican state illegal by International Law? Freedom of Religion, Free Speech etc. are all violated by this "Country". I think it should become a private establishment.

Countries have their own sovereignty. The UN and whoever can make recommendations but cannot force any countries to do anything unless they break treaties (which the Vatican has not) or have major human rights violations (even then...)

Honestly, if the Vatican (which is a sovereign [micro]nation) is illegal under international law, half of the world's countries would be as well.

--Ocram

[LexusInfernus 908]

Actually it does not. First of all, the declaration of human rights has no legal effect by itself. However, it does define certain terms of the UN charter which has binding legal effects to all its member states. But Vatican city is not a member, but rather a permanent observer. As far as I can tell it means they technically don't have to sign the charter. On top of that, countries are sovereign, meaning that only their conduct can be declared in contrary to international law, but their existence is not. And Vatican city is recognized as a fully sovereign state by international law. 

 

Aside from that, Vatican city doesn't actually breach any human rights. Freedom of religion and freedom of speech still exist.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

If the Vatican is illegal what about Mecca?  This treads on some very delicate feet.

 

The Vatican State is the result of the break up of the Holy Roman Empire, and has been around longer than many of the outfits that call themselves sovereign nations today.  If you consider that Peter the Fisherman was the first Pope, then it has been around about twice as long as Poland.

[astronelson 339]

If the Vatican is illegal what about Mecca?  This treads on some very delicate feet.

 

The Vatican State is the result of the break up of the Holy Roman Empire, and has been around longer than many of the outfits that call themselves sovereign nations today.  If you consider that Peter the Fisherman was the first Pope, then it has been around about twice as long as Poland.

 

The Vatican is either much younger than the fall or much older than the rise of the Holy Roman Empire, depending on how you define it. By the Lateran Treaty with Italy it was formed in 1929. The Papal States, however, officially started in 754 (and may or may not have ceased to exist in 1861, when Italy united, or in 1870, when Italy conquered Rome).

 

The Holy Roman Empire, of course, lasted from 962 to 1806.

 

And Poland became a country... several times. 1025 was the first one.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Glad someone looked up all this history.  But so what?  In world affairs the world community recognizes the Vatican as a sovereign state and it has an absolute monarchy with very wide reaching authority.  It is kind of and extra-territorial entity since it rules over a religious body and not much over any lands (any more).  Between Martin Luther, who wanted reform not a schism, and Henry VIII who was too full of himself to care, we now have the situation where many sects and other heresies have been allowed to flourish.

 

Sadly, the Roman Church has been the most damaging entity to world peace throughout history.  The extreme Islamists are just imitating the pattern of the early Church.  Both are bad examples.

[LexusInfernus 908]

Historically the Roman Church has not played such a damaging role. Their hands aren't clean for sure, but they are nowhere near the bad guy so many people make them out to be. Most wars were waged by states against other states, sometimes with the active support of the church, but you can be sure that those wars would have been waged even if there wouldn't have been a church. 

[Fatherted 129]

The Crusades would not have been performed had God not been the entity being fought for.

Gay Rights are being bizarrely tossed around between Christian churches, both condemning and supporting (LDS) them.

It really is strange.

[LexusInfernus 908]

The crusades had very little to do with God and much more with the influence and power of the church (political and economic power) in the Holy Land. Religion was merely a pretense to get the people fighting. 

 

That aside, the Crusades are only a few conflicts on a continent that for the most part was constantly at war with something or someone.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

^ and still is.  Has there ever been a time of peace at the east end of the Med?

 

It used to be quite a fertile place, but now it is mostly desert.  Only religiously tainted places keep up the tensions.

[LexusInfernus 908]

While we like to think of the Middle East as just desert, thats just wrong. Israel has lots of places for agriculture, Iraq has a whole stretch along the rivers, etc. 

 

And during the Ottoman reign the Middle East was quite peaceful. Most wars were fought on European soil, or they turned into naval conflicts. But it wasn't like what it is today. 

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

At the time of Moses, the area was a well-watered plain.  "A land of milk and honey" according to the Bible.  Very possibly geological change has occurred there in the 5000 years since.

 

When the Turks had their empire it was peaceful perforce.

[LexusInfernus 908]

At the time of Moses, the area was a well-watered plain.  "A land of milk and honey" according to the Bible.  Very possibly geological change has occurred there in the 5000 years since.

 

When the Turks had their empire it was peaceful perforce.

Unlikely. 5000 years is nothing on a geological time scale. And even in the time of Moses there were deserts. They supposedly trekked around in one for 40 years. 

 

Aside from that, the area is still pretty lush. Sure, not teeming with gigantic forests, but overall still pretty fertile. Plenty of olive plantations and such around there. 

 

And peaceful simply because it was enforced or not, there was peace. The area even had its own golden age while we in Europe were still to busy fighting over petty squabbles. 

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Yes, it was too bad but many of the Ottoman libraries have been destroyed.  The most recent by Islamist radicals at Timbuktu which was about the last great repository of Islamic and Ottoman thought and scholarship.  The magnitude of the Timbuktu libraries ranked with the great library at Alexandria which was destroyed by a riotous mob.  Much was lost that will never be recovered.  That's progress for you!

[Fatherted 129]

What a shame history is lost to radicalist hasa religious groups. An equal shame that human lives must be lost to these people.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Definition of hasa please?  Neither my thesaurus, nor dictionary, nor Wikipedia has a definition.

[Fatherted 129]

The word hasa is effectively a synonym to the f-word used in Uganda. It effectively means "bloody" or "f-ing", but can be used in polite circles.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Well, that is carrying euphemisms a little far.  I suppose it is a Swahili word.  Let's hope it doesn't enter general English.  English has enough such words.

 

How's your Latin vernacular?  I think some clergy are just verpae.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

Bishop of Bling gets furloughed.

 

"Do not, as some bloated ministers, show me the thorny way to heaven while themselves tread the primrose path to perdition" - A paraphrase from Wm. Shakespeare.

 

Conspicuous ostentation and wealth are clearly not one of the Pope's policies.  I hope this clown enjoys his cell in whatever monastery to which he's probably been relegated

[Fatherted 129]

Does the Vatican really deserve a place in the UN?

^I wrote this then went "North Korea..." and decided the Vatican wasn't so radical after all.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

In a word, probably not.  Observer status is sufficient unless you want to have the UN with an established religion.