(HELP) My region

[Glorg 0]

Hi I badly need help in my region development. Now I will show u my region

As u can see there is red,blue and green circle. The Red represent industrial areas with small pops. The blue represent small pops + agricultural areas and I use it as intersection . The Green is city. Total I have 233k inhabit (small eh).

Now I will show u my RCI

The R$$ and R$$$ is sinking in the bottom of sea and so is Commercial as u can see. and this RCI is similar to my next door city

but the Commercial is still at 2000-4000. What I want to ask is how to make RCI stable + high and What type of city should I build?

I might ask another question but that's for now.

Thx for your time and answer!

  Edited April 29, 2011 by Glorg  

[nicolasville 2]

Alas, I have the same problem happening at around 100,000-150,000. My guess is that it must be commute time.

[ZorusX 1]

Basically you are oversaturated with demand and rich sims. Try a few things. Check neighboring tiles' demands to make sure you can't zone industry Manufacturing or Dirty there. You can try fiddling with taxes in neighboring tiles to encourage C-S growth and discourage C-O growth. If they don't develop C-O in neighboring zones and grow C-S, it will stimulate residential demand in those area, and all those residents to commute to your offices. I'd recommend playing with taxes as a last resort.

Look at your demand. You have too many rich sims compared to poor. You need to find a way to attract more poor sims to your city, since you need them to support the rich. Also, zone for High Tech industry. This will provide jobs for richer sims (though you need a mod to fix the bug that was preventing high tech from offering R$$$ jobs). If you have trouble with growing I-HT, zone an area away from pollution, add a good amount of parks and some basic public transit. Also you MUST water the zones or HT will not grow. If you are getting a I-M and I-HT mix, i generally prune out I-M and zone for them elsewhere, though they can co-exist without too many negative effects.

As was previously said make sure you've got good public transit linking residents to jobs.

As for specifics, I'd recommend starting on the mayor 'Loeb' tile by zoning for some ghettos, and then add a i-HT zone. To make a ghetto, provide only water to your residential zones.

I really think your problem is you don't have enough poor sims to support the rich ones at their jobs. Its also possible that you DO have enough poor sims, but they are unable to commute properly to the jobs you've provided.

[Kusajika Yachiru 9]

Yeah, looks like someone zone too much high zones too fast, then while demand was high they all built their high rises only to find they didn't have enough job and all the reqirements to support them, causing the great Simy Economic Crisis! It can still be fixed, just zone what it is asking, if the citiy is full, zone in the next door one. Transitioning into high rises should be done slowly. Because insted of having 12 sims move in a lot, you're inviting 500 or more sims! Jobs get sucked dry.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

I think you have tried to go too fast without really understanding what you are doing. This is not a "now" game, and it takes some thought. It is full of little traps for the unwary. For example, the RCI chart together with the basic tutorials constitute a trap, first class.

The RCI chart shows what wealth levels you need housing for, not how to house them. The tutorial implies you can house R$ Sims in low-density housing. Nothing could be further from the truth.

Low density lots are for people who can afford houses. Unskilled farm labor and dirty industry grunts cannot afford even to buy a lot to pitch a tent on. They need high-density housing, close to work. I'll make a slight exception for farming areas, but with dirty industry, you need to zone some 2x4 high-density lots right across the road from the industrial pod, pollution notwithstanding. Uneducated R$ tend to not have cars (probably don't know how to drive if they did) so they either walk to work, or take a bus.

On that basis, you might want to rezone some of the properties next to your industry, and get your head out of the clouds or the great American myth, whichever has affected you.

  Edited April 30, 2011 by A Nonny Moose  

[Glorg 0]

Basically you are oversaturated with demand and rich sims. Try a few things. Check neighboring tiles' demands to make sure you can't zone industry Manufacturing or Dirty there. You can try fiddling with taxes in neighboring tiles to encourage C-S growth and discourage C-O growth. If they don't develop C-O in neighboring zones and grow C-S, it will stimulate residential demand in those area, and all those residents to commute to your offices. I'd recommend playing with taxes as a last resort.

Look at your demand. You have too many rich sims compared to poor. You need to find a way to attract more poor sims to your city, since you need them to support the rich. Also, zone for High Tech industry. This will provide jobs for richer sims (though you need a mod to fix the bug that was preventing high tech from offering R$$$ jobs). If you have trouble with growing I-HT, zone an area away from pollution, add a good amount of parks and some basic public transit. Also you MUST water the zones or HT will not grow. If you are getting a I-M and I-HT mix, i generally prune out I-M and zone for them elsewhere, though they can co-exist without too many negative effects.

As was previously said make sure you've got good public transit linking residents to jobs.

As for specifics, I'd recommend starting on the mayor 'Loeb' tile by zoning for some ghettos, and then add a i-HT zone. To make a ghetto, provide only water to your residential zones.

I really think your problem is you don't have enough poor sims to support the rich ones at their jobs. Its also possible that you DO have enough poor sims, but they are unable to commute properly to the jobs you've provided.

Thanx dude now I know how important is poor sims and thanx all of you. btw any of you using City Ordinances? is that important? I only use Legalize Gambling and dunno the rest have impact or no. btw this is my RCI for new city

From the RCI above it seem that I need to build industrial-residential zone hahaha btw any suggestion for the taxes? shud I lower it or stay in 9%?

  Edited April 30, 2011 by Glorg  

[ZorusX 1]

Build the zones they are demanding first, and if that doesn't work, try improving transit. If those fail you are probably still missing something. Fiddle with taxes only if you want certain tiles to provide certain types of jobs. You really shouldn't need to touch them at all if you are doing things right. But you can use them to saturate office demand in your downtown while keeping CS on your outskirts, or banning dirty industry from your I-HT zones.

If you aren't careful with taxes you can have some really nasty things happen so be warned.

[Ironic-Veneer 1]

NonnyMoose, that stuff about low-density being unaffordable for low wealth sims is simply not true. Density and wealth are not correlated at all in SC4. You can have plenty of low wealth, low density duplexs/trailer parks, or you can have high density tenements/towers for low wealth sims. For Glorg I would recommend building high density slums, simply because the demand for low wealth sims is so high that it would take up many tiles of low density slums and getting the traffic system right for that requires a fair amount of planning, patience and tweaking.

As for the mode of transportation that sims take, a certain percentage of each wealth group prefers cars or public transit, while another chunk of sims simply prefer whatever mode is fastest. Low wealth sims have a large preference for mass transit, so if you build a system that delivers them to their jobs, you'll find it will get a lot of use.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

NonnyMoose, that stuff about low-density being unaffordable for low wealth sims is simply not true. Density and wealth are not correlated at all in SC4. You can have plenty of low wealth, low density duplexs/trailer parks, or you can have high density tenements/towers for low wealth sims. For Glorg I would recommend building high density slums, simply because the demand for low wealth sims is so high that it would take up many tiles of low density slums and getting the traffic system right for that requires a fair amount of planning, patience and tweaking.

As for the mode of transportation that sims take, a certain percentage of each wealth group prefers cars or public transit, while another chunk of sims simply prefer whatever mode is fastest. Low wealth sims have a large preference for mass transit, so if you build a system that delivers them to their jobs, you'll find it will get a lot of use.

Well, I used to think that, but in the nine years I've been playing the game, my results have shown otherwise. It used to work that way before Rush Hour, but apparently not any more because I get successful, profitable cities doing it my way.

[Glorg 0]

btw anyone know tutorial video about NAM thingy? just give me link becoz

I'm having bit trouble in making it and to make it very usefull. lol I fail several times and it's looks ugly and not functioning well ;p

[Mithrik 562]

You read the Read Me file? (how redundant question )

There you should get a simple guide to control the NAM.

[Ironic-Veneer 1]

NonnyMoose, that stuff about low-density being unaffordable for low wealth sims is simply not true. Density and wealth are not correlated at all in SC4. You can have plenty of low wealth, low density duplexs/trailer parks, or you can have high density tenements/towers for low wealth sims. For Glorg I would recommend building high density slums, simply because the demand for low wealth sims is so high that it would take up many tiles of low density slums and getting the traffic system right for that requires a fair amount of planning, patience and tweaking.

As for the mode of transportation that sims take, a certain percentage of each wealth group prefers cars or public transit, while another chunk of sims simply prefer whatever mode is fastest. Low wealth sims have a large preference for mass transit, so if you build a system that delivers them to their jobs, you'll find it will get a lot of use.

Well, I used to think that, but in the nine years I've been playing the game, my results have shown otherwise. It used to work that way before Rush Hour, but apparently not any more because I get successful, profitable cities doing it my way.

But why would the density zoned matter when there are only three wealth groups and each wealth group can live in each density? Does the game have some kind of mechanic where each wealth group prefers a certain density?

[Vern 29]

NonnyMoose, that stuff about low-density being unaffordable for low wealth sims is simply not true. Density and wealth are not correlated at all in SC4. You can have plenty of low wealth, low density duplexs/trailer parks, or you can have high density tenements/towers for low wealth sims. For Glorg I would recommend building high density slums, simply because the demand for low wealth sims is so high that it would take up many tiles of low density slums and getting the traffic system right for that requires a fair amount of planning, patience and tweaking.

As for the mode of transportation that sims take, a certain percentage of each wealth group prefers cars or public transit, while another chunk of sims simply prefer whatever mode is fastest. Low wealth sims have a large preference for mass transit, so if you build a system that delivers them to their jobs, you'll find it will get a lot of use.

Well, I used to think that, but in the nine years I've been playing the game, my results have shown otherwise. It used to work that way before Rush Hour, but apparently not any more because I get successful, profitable cities doing it my way.

But why would the density zoned matter when there are only three wealth groups and each wealth group can live in each density? Does the game have some kind of mechanic where each wealth group prefers a certain density?

This is an interesting discussion. I would love to hear others opinion on this.

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

I think that Will Wright and his boys were pretty subtle. I've taken to looking at the RCI graph as a sort of set of building permits, especially for housing. A big demand for R$ housing at the beginning of the game generally after you have zoned some dirty industry, seems to respond very well to high density lots of the 2 x 4 and 3 x 3 variety. I often get high rise tenements on these.

Funny how, when there is no CS$$$ demand I can zone a high density commercial 6 x 6 and almost immediately get either a shopping mall or a fashion center. This provides quite a few commercial jobs.

Generally, when I am starting up without I-Ag, I start with I-$$, often around a seaport. This works quite well, and when you zone some R-HD right up against it, pollution or no, the buildings go up, and the Sims move in. Quite often I have to place more than one school here until I get the large elementary school.

Some of my current rules of thumb after these:

I-D gets taxed at 20%, but only after four years. I harvest them while they run down. I generally don't discourage I-M, except maybe later when I jack their taxes up over 9%.

I generally drop the I-Ag taxes to 7% at the same time I jack up the I-D.

As profit builds, I keep an eye on it, and when the income rate is getting over 10G per month, I start lowering taxes uniformly on everyone else. Usually in decrements of 0.2 % across the board. I don't use differential tax structures because it becomes too complex in the end. A drop of 30 basis points is usually significant. In one of my big cities, the general tax rate is around 5% and I am still making around 10G a month. You have to watch this if you do any major (re)development. You may have to put taxes back up a few basis points for a while.

I build my first secondary school when the general population gets to be around 6,000. And I try to keep enough secondary schools around to satisfy demand. A secondary school always gets a soccer field.

I don't always build the university when I get it. Sometimes I hold out for other things. I do this with several rewards. For example, I don't build the Mayor's house until I get the City Hall as well. Sometimes I name the City Hall "Temple of Nonny" and the Mayor's House "Fane of Nonny".

If I place the Air Force Base, I always name it CFB "cityname". I usually build it near the university which I also name for the city. Building the university also triggers a small airport to use as a flying school. Most of my universities have an aeronautical division, a medial school and an EMO school. My universities usually start out as out-of-town pods connected by rapid transit of some kind. It allows me to have "university" housing, and a commercial pod. Etc, etc. I am sure you don't want a full write up on my current style.

[Glorg 0]

ok here's the progress of my city

Before... ugly

as u can see I'm no zoning High density

finally I can use NAM properly

so what do you think? btw the RCI is still the same R$$ & R$$$ still below. but the Commercial is rising slowly.

the Industry RCI is still at max graph which is good eh?. and so far no commute time problem

  Edited May 1, 2011 by Glorg  

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

To me, its got that "I need some subdivisions" look. Move off a little and create a residential pod that consists of a large block of middle level 2 x 2 lots (W key), and a fringe of high density 2 x 2 lots both in clusters of 8. Between the city and the suburb create a road or avenue with at least one high density 6 x 6 commercial on it. Do a backup of your region first, and if you don't like the result, you can back out.

[Glorg 0]

My City [Final]

looking nice eh

RCI

In the end it's always the same -_-. so I just need to build a more suburb then?

so far only industrial RCI section is stable. What you suggest? Industry or suburb? just can't wait to get skycrapper =(

  Edited May 2, 2011 by Glorg  

[A Nonny Moose 8,261]

No city is ever final unless you plan to publish it as a CJ. With the exception of some French cities I've been in no cities are pretty. Mostly they just growed. The prettier ones are often thousands of years old. Two of the most beautiful I've seen are Paris and Bordeaux. Both of them over 2,000 years old, and both started as Roman camps. To beatify a city means many, many centuries of urban redevelopment to get what you want, so don't rush, just keep working at it. Believe me, none of the big, gorgeous cities in Europe or anywhere else were built in a few days.

[Glorg 0]

quick question

can Freight and Passenger train properly functioning in the same rail?

[CaptCity 4,752]

quick question

can Freight and Passenger train properly functioning in the same rail?

Yes, both types operate on the same rail lines. Freight will travel from industry or a freight station to the edge of a city. Passenger traffic will travel between passenger stations of the same or different cities. Both automata will appear on the same lines if both types of traffic exists.

[Kusajika Yachiru 9]

One thing to always remember...

Highrises generate less money than those who live in houses... though, I base that of the guide.

I always start low, then grow high. Then when I do grow high, I zone small, small sections at a time so jobs don't get out of control.

[Glorg 0]

quick question

can Freight and Passenger train properly functioning in the same rail?

Yes, both types operate on the same rail lines. Freight will travel from industry or a freight station to the edge of a city. Passenger traffic will travel between passenger stations of the same or different cities. Both automata will appear on the same lines if both types of traffic exists.

Ok thx! now I have another source for income.

btw I decided to make a Small town with few houses and Dirty Industry area. Well here's the picture of it :

And becoz of that town it stimulate my R$$ and R$$$ in my major city and I'm happy =) but ye I face another problem =(

with no more land to zone and bad Commercial RCI

[Kusajika Yachiru 9]

Tear down what you don't need and rezone. There is always room for improvments. But if, if everything is filled, I suggest a another new city. Good luck!

[MandelSoft 2,769]

You may want to check the following things:

• Zones: Have you actually zoned medium and high density commercial zones? This looks like an obvious question, but you may have missed this.
  
• Air pollution: I see you have a coal power plant in your city, and this may affect commercial, ressidential and I-HT zones negatively. Try to use cleaner forms of electricity production. Solar power is expensive, but quite effective and safe.
  
• Trash amounts: if you have trash scattered around in your city, this will have a negative effect on growth or worse, people are moving away from the city. If you have too much trash in you city, try to get rid of it by export or burning it.
  
• Congestion: some roads may be clogged up, having a negative effect on growth and demand. Some roads may need to be converted into one-way roads.
  
• How does everyone go to work? You may want to check your route query too to see who works where and how they get there.
  

I hope these tips will help you.

Best,

Maarten

[Glorg 0]

You may want to check the following things:

• Zones: Have you actually zoned medium and high density commercial zones? This looks like an obvious question, but you may have missed this.
  
• Air pollution: I see you have a coal power plant in your city, and this may affect commercial, ressidential and I-HT zones negatively. Try to use cleaner forms of electricity production. Solar power is expensive, but quite effective and safe.
  
• Trash amounts: if you have trash scattered around in your city, this will have a negative effect on growth or worse, people are moving away from the city. If you have too much trash in you city, try to get rid of it by export or burning it.
  
• Congestion: some roads may be clogged up, having a negative effect on growth and demand. Some roads may need to be converted into one-way roads.
  
• How does everyone go to work? You may want to check your route query too to see who works where and how they get there.
  

I hope these tips will help you.

Best,

Maarten

Thx dude it does help! but for R$$ and R$$$ and it's skyrocket but not for Commercial

So I concentrate all my Powerplant in Western Gate and basically just deliver it thru powerlines but it's ugly + Solar powerplant

and now for RCI

I don't have problem with trash or traffic and I do have zone Med and High commercial

any other solution?