City won't grow up

[jdfess6 0]

Ok so I have a few problems with a new city i'm building. It won't grow up. I have the CBD all zoned high-density, a good GLR going through it, bus stops, and everything, but it won't grow up. It just stays at those little medium-rise buildings. I don't know why.

Also, the demand for my CO$$$ is MAXED OUT. And I don't know why. If they want it that bad why don't they build up? It doesn't make sense to me.

[Teaten 0]

what is your population? usually HDR won't develop until you're over 23k

[Streetwise 3]

Do you have any other cities neighboring that one? Cities usually grow better when connected to others.

[tycoonsimraider123 16]

I want to know the answer to this problem too because i am having the same problem???

[Boycey08 0]

and me aswell

got an industrial city with about 12,000 jobs, 70k residential population in the main city, 1200 HT jobs in the main city and a very large commercial area with CO-$$$ demand at about 40% and CO-$$ demand maxxed out

on vanilla with this situation id have been swimming in skyscrapers, my game setting is on easy since its my first city with deluxe, so either something is wrong, or im doing something wrong

demand caps dont come into it either, ive got large plazas all over the place, as well as a host of trees

[Dizastrow 4]

Do you have lots of parks and green space in your city?

Have you lowered taxes?

Have you checked on commute times?

Do you have enough education?

Is your industry too close to the residential neighborhoods?

[Boycey08 0]

Do you have lots of parks and green space in your city? yes i do

Have you lowered taxes? for CO- $$ and $$$ yes

Have you checked on commute times? long commute time, but ive just bulldozed every residence in the city, now im hoping to rebuild the road system abit to fix the commute and im adding a el-rail, but i doubt it'll be used

Do you have enough education? yes i do

Is your industry too close to the residential neighborhoods? dirty/manufacturing industry is out of the city, the HT industry is over the highway from the residential

[TimeMaster 4]

Ok, answer all of these..

-Are ALL your schools funded enough to avoid overcrowding?

-Are ALL your hospitals funded enough to avoid over crowding?

-Are ALL your libraries and museums funded enough to give the people what they

want?

-Do you have enough police stations and fire stations to cover your whole city?

-Do you have enough jails so they have room to accomodate more prisoners?

-Is your trash amount under your capacity?

-Are you getting few (if any) complaints on the tax rate?

-Are all zones and buildings powered and watered?

-Are you getting any complaints on commute time?...Those problems are easy to fix. Of course, if you answered yes to those

questions, here's the second (shorter) list...

-Are ALL your zones set to maximum density? (assuming you want maximum density;

farms can't be in areas that dense, of course)

-Do you have an airport complimenting your commercial sector?

-Do you have a seaport complimenting your industrial sector?

If you said yes to all, you hit a peanut butter point.

Here... Read it. I got like 95% of this from a walkthrough somewhere.

The Peanut Butter Point is not the end of your game; in fact, it's the start of

a whole new set of challenges.

The first thing you need to do when hitting that point is not to panic. In my

rookie days, I used to think that the reason people weren't coming in was

because there was something wrong with my policies. So, I lowered tax rates,

issued more ordinances, built tons of parks, and generally threw in a whole

bunch of stuff to make everyone happy... or so I thought. Between the lowered

tax and new ordinances, though, my money well quickly ran dry.

The question you're asking by now is, how can you make your city overcome that

Peanut Butter Point. A common phrase in comedy and the entertainment industry

in general is "Leave your audience wanting more."

Concentrate on what is RIGHT in your town. There is very, VERY seldom the

perfect city. If you've hit the Peanut Butter Point, it's not because the city

is too bad, nor is it that your city is too good; it's because there's too

much of a balance between what you have right and what you have wrong. I hate

saying this, but for the sims' own good, the best way to make your city get out

of its sticky trap is to piss everyone off.

Before starting, make sure you have plenty of cash. This method can get a bit

expensive.

Find the best part of town. Just check the map and look for whatever place has

the highest land value and highest city aura. If you have multiple spots, pick

an area that is pretty big, but not the biggest. Call this place "Ground Zero."

Find out why the land value is so high; it's usually high education and low

crime. Grab the keys to your trusty bulldozer, start that MF'er up, and give

the kiddies a permanent vacation from school--break open the jails too, while

you're at it.

I know it sounds crazy, but trust me. Let the city be confused for awhile.

They'll complain and yell about how crappy the town is, but believe it or not,

that's what you want temporarily. Take some money (in your coffers, if you can,

NOT a loan), and go to a new section of town. Start a "new city" over in that

corner. Pretend you're starting a new game, just with an inflated bank account.

Build a new, cheap power plant. Build some zones of all three flavors, use

streets instead of roads, avoid any police or fire coverage, and refuse to give

them any education. Meanwhile, head back to Ground Zero and take out a few

dozen parks or so... Do NOT re-zone or destroy any existing RCI buildings.

After a few months, the city aura and value in Ground Zero will just absolutely

plummet. However, your sims try to move across town before across the nation.

They'll see that new little area you've got developing in the corner of the

map, and they'll take interest. While they're thinking of the good ol' days,

cut off their water.

Back at the new colony, start giving the BASIC services: one elementary school,

one clinic, one small police station, and no fire stations... well, maybe a

small one, if you feel sorry for 'em. You MIGHT already have a few people

coming in, but still not enough to make you get out of your trap.

After that little colony is established, expand it out. Again, pretend it's a

new city; just ignore that big mess of people on the other side of the river.

Build some parks and other recreational areas, and raise the zones' densities

now and then. Once it looks pretty solid, build a road that connects this

little colony to the main city. Get a subway connecting the two also if you can

to make any commuter stupid enough to make THAT trip happy.

People will start to come into the new colony SLOWLY. This is not an instant

method here, it takes some time. But, while you're biding that time, you can

help out other sectors. For example, one thing that's commonly overlooked in

SimCity 4 is your industrial zones' distances to freight access. They like

being close to extra-city connections, especially railroads. If that's not an

option, they want a freight station (linked to a railroad going out of town, of

course) that's very close by. Try to improve that too.

Eventually, the demand will be met for the colony, but because it was smaller

than Ground Zero, there will still be demand for the city as a whole. You may

want to start upgrading stuff around the colony (like bigger police stations

and such), but don't. If you feel the need to give them SOMETHING, let 'em have

water. Otherwise, that's the ghetto of your city; let it suffer for now.

So, to fill the rest of that demand, you need to restore Ground Zero. Work

backwards: give them back water, then parks, then their services. Do it slowly

enough that the area doesn't get flooded, but work fast enough that everyone

forgets the place exists. I find that restoring one part of Ground Zero ever

three to four months works the best. In time, people who moved to the colony

will move back, or the newcomers who started in the colony will move into

Ground Zero. That will free up room in the colony, and it's STILL cheap land

for the poorer classes to afford.

Once Ground Zero is restored, start upgrading the colony to make it a

full-fledged suburb, or maybe a large city of its own. Even before it maxxes

out its borders though, expand as much as you can. The big thing is to keep low

land value areas that are ripe for the poor to live in. This way, you're always

"leaving your sims wanting more." They want better education or whatever in the

new colonies; don't give it to them unless 1) it's all that's left for your

city borders, or 2) you have plenty of low-value area as well.

-Time

[Dizastrow 4]

I would just start over. LOL!

[tycoonsimraider123 16]

I never thought i would do that but i might give it a try???

[jdfess6 0]

I know I'm not at the peanut butter point. I was there in my other city, but this one is WAYY too new.

My taxes aren't receiving any complaints. The average commute time is 25-30 and it's medium. I have a GLR on the main part of my city. My education is superb, and health is up there as well.

I have high tech industry pretty close to my residential, but only because that's where it says it will grow best, it won't grow anywhere else.

[jdfess6 0]

Also, I have a lot of plazas and parks. And a good bus system as well.

[TimeMaster 4]

Are you sure? And, how is the demand in your city?

[Darth Apple 54]

TimeMaster: that was a HUGE post!

I have had a similar problem in both sc3000 and sc4 , make sure you havent taxed one particular occupant type too heavily(uhh...) make sure you have balanced your demand(if industry demand is high - zone more industry , etc...) this should help

[Archimonde 0]

hello from croatia! i have years of sc3k playing experience, and have bought sc4 recently. i have problem with building high commercial skyscrapers. Main city has 6 connected cities, region (london) is more then half built and is populated with more than 1500000 residents. main city has 220000 residents, more then 100000 working in commercial sector. traffic is good, desirability and land value high, education is excellent, iq is 190, commercial cap is high. main city has airport, highway, road and subway connections with neighbouring cities. i have few ideas what could be the problem: life expectancy is about 50 and that looks quite low, altough hospital coverage is good and they are well funded. customers number is somewhat low, and i have no idea what to do about that. also i am not sure how to manage regions and economic and traffic relations between main and smaller cities. taxes for commerce is 7 %. if someone knows the solution please help, i can't go back to 3k, it sucks compare to 4 )

[jdfess6 0]

My demand for High-tech is really big, but whenever I try to zone high-density industry away from pollution it just makes manufacturing.

Also, my demand for CO$$$ is HUGEE, and that's why I don't see why they won't build up.

[Archimonde 0]

if u want high tech u have to raise taxes for manufacturing and dirty above 12% and that is I$ and I$$ for commercial i have the same problem

[jdfess6 0]

My taxes for them are above that.

[Yuu Caa Sim 55]

Make sure you're zoning high density in high desirability areas (by looking at the data map FOR THE PARTICULAR OCCUPANT TYPE that you want)

Also, it may be that stage caps are coming into play. All buildings are assigned a growth stage. This identifier is used by the simulator to determine which building is built in the region. The stage types are assigned a certain percentage of the current population, and if they represent less than thier intended percentage in the region, then buildings in that stage type are built until they reach or exceed the percentage of population in the region. The percentage of population that each stage type gets changes as the population grows, so you will only get skyscrapers when the population for that specific occupant type gets high enough (usually over 100000, except for R$ and some others). This is a regional feature, so that you can satisfy the demand for small houses not by building them in your downtown city tiles, but in the suburban city tiles.

Demand for commercial and industrial depends also on the rate of education that your sims have. Those Commercial Office towers require highly educated sims, which require a longer lifespan to achieve. All of this takes many sim-years to achieve.

[jdfess6 0]

Ok, so explain that stage type thing to me again.

because I just started another city and the CO$$$ is MAXED out, completely.

[Yuu Caa Sim 55]

Growth stage = Each Growth stage is goes up to a threshold population. Each Growth stage has a different composition of Stage limits.

Building stage = A property tied to a lot, usually related to how many people work/live on the lot (how dense a lot is).

Stage limit = the maximum percentage that a certain Building stage can be present in a certain Growth Stage.

To get Simcity to build the building you want, you need to take into account demand and desirability, and development. Growth stages go into the development portion of this equation (they come into play when the simulator has chosen a location to develop, and is deciding what building to build). The growth of an occupant type in the region is divided into Growth Stages defined by the population. Each of these Growth Stages go up to a population threshold, and has attached to it the limit each of the building stages can represent of the population of that certain occupant group.

Simply put, to see higher buildings, you need a higher growth stage, which requires higher population. To see more higher buildings, your population needs to increase, possibly by spreading out over the map in smaller buildings and not being packed into a skyscraper. Just because you have high demand doesn't mean you will get skyscrapers (but they are needed to fulfill the high amount of population that work/live in the skyscrapers).

You can also look under Changes to the RCI Model at the excerpt from the official strategy guide -> http://simcity.ea.com/downloads/getfile_pri.php?&filename=PrimaGuideRH.pdf (if you're registered on the official Maxis website) to get a better understanding of growth stages and stage limits.

-----------------------------------------------

Do you have any CO$$$ skyscrapers in your region? If so, the amount of population in those towers may be higher than the current growth stage distribution says it should be, and you will only see low rises being built until the lower building stages population reaches the percentage they should be at for the current growth stage.

You never mentioned what your population is. Remember, regional population for CO$$$ (not the amount in the region view) must be above 50000 or so to see the skyscapers. You may need to build more CO$$$ low/mid rises to see the skyscrapers. You can check how much population you have of a specific occupant type by looking through the graphs view.

One more thing... There are no high density High Tech buildings, so you shouldn't zone high density in areas you want I-HT to appear.

[tycoonsimraider123 16]

Well i have been adding tall skyscrapers from the Stex that are CO$$$ and plopping them in the city, is this a good way to relieve the CO$$$

[jdfess6 0]

I think I get it now, thanks

[Evillions 552]

Better yet get CAM. Solves your problems no time.

[kingdiz_55 12]

Here are some problems that occur.

1. Commute time is long.

For this, I would suggest roads 6x6 tiles apart. I learned from somewhere that the Sims in the city don't walk more than 6 tiles until they find a bus station at least.

2. Pollution

Again, a common technique is to place the industrial zone away from the residential and commercial areas but this would mean commute time would get long so, another suggestion, get the HSRP.

3. Population

According to the official handbook of the game, you need at least 26,000 people in the city for skyscrapers to appear.

4. Water

Many people don't know that you need water to at, the least get apartments(medium density zone).

5. Desirability

This is the hardest one yet to achieve. The main tip is to place the CS and CO near the R zone.

[Archimonde 0]

there are still no skyscrapers in my city i have planted threes and that solved air polution probem - moustly, it is on very low levels now. only thing i can think off is commute and custumers. commute is quite high, and customers low. how to solve that? i have good subway network and have no traffic probem. i have also 2 airports, international and municipal, both upgraded to large and they are working properly, i have also built highways and some railroad through the city and connections with neighbours. how to increase customers number and to decrease commute? what si optimal percentage for commercial taxes to encourage commercial growth?

[Dizastrow 4]

At this point I would suggest "CHEATING"!!! 

[Archimonde 0]

where's the fun in that? i am buiding new region

[exterminatorss 0]

Apart from all other things mentioned in previous posts it is also very important to have a lot of traffic along roads where you want commercial skyscrapers to pop up.

[shawnfog 0]

So you have answered all the obligatory questions in the affirmative. My city also has all the same services as yours and it's booming with skyscrapers everywhere. I think we need to declare shenanigans on your city...it must be just a bug. SC4 is full of weird bugs, maybe cause Maxis couldn't forsee them or got lazy. I'm not sure but I would do eithe rdo something drastic like blow up half your city or start over.