belfastuniguy

Originally posted by: saltandsauce Originally posted by: belfastuniguy jobs in general are VERY hard to get even the cleaning jobs. dole money is going to go down because of more people on it and that is going to make people more reluctant to go into unemployment if they can avoid itquote> Actually they're not. There are still a hell of a lot of job vacancies in the UK at the minute. People here just tend to be incredibly fussy and would rather sit on their arse sponging off taxes than do jobs they believe they are too good for. quote> considering i have failed catastrophically at my highers, i have applied for every job available (as i have no alternative and am ineligable for unemployment benefits), and have been turned down for all of them because i'm not "experienced" in using a mop. One must require a university degree for shelf stacking or toilet unblocking. good for you getting a big fat pay rise, i'm curious as to what your job is? (i know i won't get it since i can't go to university) quote> I'm the manager of a Savile Row men's tailoring concession. Business has been very good and we're beating our targets, so I got a pay rise. I'm only doing that while waiting to join the police. My degree places me on the fast track development and promotion scheme they have.

Also a part of the christian religion is about forgiveness, wether he is guilty or not, condsidering he is dying could we not see it in our hearts to forgive.quote> I'm not a Christian, so I'm not bound by anything to forgive anyone. Yes, but Ronnie Biggs never killed anyone, he stole millions of pounds. This guy has killed people so I hardly see it fair that he can be released on 'compassionate grounds'. Victims aren't being given enough justice and criminals are being given too many rights. It's a stupid law.quote> Correct, but the law exists for everyone, it's not a pick-and-mix law. You may see it as stupid, and that's your opinion. However, his fate is for the Scottish Justice Secretary to decide upon. What is worst about this situation, in my opinion, is not that Megrahi might be released but that his appeal has been dropped becuase he thinks this will help him get released. The appeal might have brought out more evidence, either to show that Megrahi was not primarily responsible or to reinforced the orginal conviction, helping the famillies not satisfied by the initial coviction to see justice done.quote> I agree, the case was rather dubious and doubts do exists. I personally would have liked to have seen the second appeal go forward so more of the facts could come out.

Originally posted by: Kryptowhite And thats why scotland and england should set up secret prisons in foreign countries where they send the really bad criminals so they don't have to supply them basic rights. Tell me again, whose idea it was that we should give basic rights and comfortable living space to prisoners who have killed 10, 20, 100, 200, people?quote> Sorry, but the United Kingdom and all of its constituent countries respect the rule of law and human rights. We have one of the oldest and fairest legal systems in the world, one which has been copied and one which has influenced systems in countries across the globe. I don't see that happening any-time soon, we'll leave that to other nations that hold human rights with less respect.

Rather funny wiki article I discovered. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Struma_motorway The Struma motorway is part of the European corridor No 4. Its construction will cost around €600 000 000 000 000 0000 0000.01 and will provide fast connection between Sofia and the Greek city Thessaloniki. Some 40 km of the highway near Dupnitsa were built in 2006-2007. It is expected to be finished in 2012-2013 and become the most beautiful motorway in all of Europe with the extremely and blindingly shiniest crashbarriers and the obscenely smoothest tarmac. It will have thick white lines and be built on a dike more than 30 meters high in order for the motorway to never have to go up or down. It will have the blackest, smoothest tarmac ever conceived. The crashbarriers will be so hideously intensely shiny and strong so that they never dent. This is really by far the best motorway ever humanly formulated in the history of mankind. There is no motorway better than this motorway. Again, the crashbarriers are super-duper shiny, the asphalt is blacker than a black hole, and the lines are while like pearls and extremely thick and heavy duty. The motorway will also be impeccably clean, with no sand, dirt, snow, mud, trash, or debris on it, ever. The motorway will lead through mountainous terrain, also the prettiest landscape in all the world. You can't even feel the turns on this motorway. The feeling one has while driving this motorway is unparalleled; it is inexplicably amazing to be driving on this motorway, with the glistening shiny crashbarriers, very dark black tarmac, and super thick white lines whooshing by you. The gas stations along this motorway look like spacestations from Mars, with their super-bright lights glowing and zooming past you as you drive over 160 km/h. There are some protests by environmentalists who don't want the motorway to lead through the Kresna gorge, a 13 km, narrow gorge, rich of rare animals and plants. It is located between the towns Simitli and Kresna. Update: 23:06:2007 Companies have signed cotracts and should start work on two new sections of the Struma motorway in about 1 month as the as the minister of road infrastructure Veselin Georgiev said. the companies will build new sections which will connect Dupnica with the already built section of the Struma motorway currently ending near the village of Dolna Dykania. the other section of the motorway will connect the town of Sandanski with the Bulgarian- Greek border near the village of Kulata. together the new sections will have a lengh of about 50 km. They are expected to be finished by 2009, The section Dolna Dykania - Dupnica will lead through mountainous terrain and probably pass near the Diakovo artificial lake. On the section Sandanski Kulata the current national road E-79 will partly be used and new lines will be added. the section Dolna Dykania - Dupnica however will not be constructed on the current road. Feeder roads must be build to connect the current road E-79 with the new sections of the Struma motorway. the motorway will offer a panoramic view of the Rila mountain in Dupnica. Of course, this all will happen if EU gives money to Bulgaria because they must do it. If they don't give money, they are nationalistic imbeciles. Bulgaria joined to EU to get the money for Struma motorway and will spend its money to other things. EU is simply supposed to finance this glorious project! This is the best motorway ever! EU is bunch of imbeciles and they need to fund Bulgarian motorway Struma so that it can have mind-bogglingly shiny crashbarriers.quote>

That's alright. I agree with rotting in prison. I do wish prisons weren't so comfortable though. That really annoys me, bit of Victorian prison austerity for the worse crimes is what I'd like to see. None of this TV, gym or recreational rubbish.

I'm not defending him btw.......just explaining why the situation has come about. I also would rather he die in prison. So why should he be released after JUST 8 YEARS due to the fact he is terminal and wants to spend his last moments with his family?quote> Under British Law, you can be released for compassionate reasons if you are close to death The most recent case was that a few weeks ago of Ronnie Biggs, the Great Train Robber. He was released from prison to go and die in hospital.

Well apologies for having a sense of civilised morality. What he did was horrific and he deserves to die in prison, but executing him is no better. Then again, the event occurred over British territory and thankfully we do not have the death penalty, thus the issue is a non-issue.

I say just put a bullet in his head and be done with it, but that's the easy way out.quote> Yes it is the easy way out and it also makes us no better than those like them that kill.

t a) she would not have access to that breathing machine. which is ridiculous since that "machine" is basically a calibrated toilet paper roll; and b) if she had registered as above norm for a woman her age and height, the doctor would have concluded that no treatment was required. which is also ridiculous because there is no reason to be in pain while breathing when a few days of medicine will fix that condition.quote> Breathing machines are readily available, on that you're correct, I'm not sure why she believed that. I asked my mother, who's a Paediatrician. She said that allergies are treated seriously with numerous tests. A patient always have the option of a second opinion also. Then there is the issue of medical tests. My friends and I were watching a TV show where they were talking about the serotonin levels of one of the characters. My friends wanted to know why the sci-fi aspect of the show was being carried over into hospital scenes when the characters (Mulder and Scully) supposedly exist in the same time/space continuum that we do. I told them there is such a test; a blood test that shows serum serotonin levels. It was news to them. They thought it was science fiction. Then there is the issue of specific illnesses. At one point, I got bronchitis (again). My Brit friend seemed convinced that was an automatic three weeks off of work. What's up with that? Then there is the issue of surgerical procedures. I had to have one done (I'll spare you the details). My Brit friend seemed convinced that would be four months off of work. I told her I'd be back to work in less than a week. Turns out I had it done laproscopically while she was convinced that a British doctor would have just hacked his way in the old way, making whatever incisions he needed to make along the way. I had four incisions. The longest was 3/4 of an inch.quote> That sounds a bit ridiculous, I don't wish to be rude toward your friend, but I'm assuming she had very little knowledge of healthcare in the UK or aware of what tests are available. Most likely becuase she has never had them. That's what I can gather. You can avail of sick leave in the UK on the provision of a doctors note. Not sure why she thought three weeks though. I'm not sure when you were visiting but things have likely changed since then (X-File years), most sick leave has reduced significantly. As for the laproscopic procedure, again that may have been a time period realted issue. Knowing when you visited would help as I'm assuming during the Conservative years, a government which seemingly took pleasure in cutting NHS budgets. Since Labour came into power in 1997 investment has soared with some fantastic achievements.

Many Americans look at the NHS and see a huge HMO. Not saying that is a fair comparison but that is what it can look like from here. and we know that HMOs are not a good thing.quote> Yeah I can see why some would make the connection. Though it's not entirely accurate. A similar system does exist in the UK, whereas you visit your GP and they then refer you to hospital and arrange appointments for specialists. However, the GP can't stop you from receiving care, they don't have the final say. Also important to not that unlike in American, the GP's here are not going to be concerned about conforming to insurance guideline or cost issues. So in that respect the comparison is flawed.

Lockerbie bomber’s release ‘delayed by pressure from Hillary Clinton’ The Scottish government appears to have buckled under pressure from the Obama Administration and abandoned its plans to release the Lockerbie bomber this week. Senior sources said that there was “no chance” of Abdul Baset Ali al-Megrahi being sent back to Libya on Wednesday as had been expected. The plan to release the convicted terrorist, who has dropped his appeal against conviction, and return him to his native Libya, was thrown out after the intervention of Hillary Clinton, the US Secretary of State. It is understood that Alex Salmond, the First Minister, summoned Kenny MacAskill, the Scottish Justice Secretary, to a meeting on Friday amid fears that the decision for a release on compassionate grounds would lead to an international backlash. Al-Megrahi has advanced prostate cancer. Mr MacAskill has now dropped a plan to allow al-Megrahi to leave Scotland in time for the start of Ramadan, around August 22, as Libya had wanted, amid concerns that he would receive a hero’s welcome. A spokesman for the Scottish Government said that a decision would be made on al-Megrahi’s application for compassionate release before the end of the month. He denied that the timetable had slipped as a result of US pressure. The spokesman added: “We have always been aware of the American viewpoint.” The latest situation was criticised by leading Scottish QCs. Paul McBride, QC, who acts as an adviser to the Conservative Party, said: “In America if you murder someone you go to jail and die there if necessary. Why should we let this man out, particularly now that he has dropped his appeal, therefore acknowledging he is a mass murderer?” He added: “This is now beyond shambolic. Kenny MacAskill has not told us what he plans to do. There have been all sorts of different scenarios and this is all about seeing which one attracts the most favourable reaction. This is not about a brave man making a bold decision; it is about Kenny MacAskill trying to get the best publicity for himself.” That criticism was echoed by Gordon Jackson, QC, a former Labour MSP. “There appears to be total panic and dither,” he said. “There is a sense of no firm grip on the situation and they are starting to look a bit silly. One day one thing is happening and the next day something else is happening. They are letting the situation drift. “I cannot see what information they will have next week that they don’t have this week. I am assuming there are other pressures on Kenny MacAskill.” Al-Megrahi’s decision to withdraw his appeal led to speculation that a deal had been struck to allow his release from Greenock prison in return for the potentially embarrassing proceedings to be halted. The appeal, which could have continued after his death, is expected to be formally dropped in court tomorrow. Jim Swire, whose daughter Flora was among the 271 people killed in the 1988 Lockerbie bombing, is considering taking legal action against the Crown Office, which is responsible for prosecutions in Scotland. He believes that al-Megrahi is innocent and wants to use human rights legislation to sue the Crown Office for denying him the chance to discover who was responsible for his daughter’s death. Dr Swire has written to Mr MacAskill telling him that he might also try to “seek annulment of the findings of the Lockerbie fatal accident inquiry on grounds of withholding of evidence and then seek a new inquiry or legitimate equivalent in its place”. The Scottish Government is understood to want a public inquiry after al-Megrahi has been sent back to Libya and his appeal has been officially dropped. Al-Megrahi’s medical condition is believed to be deteriorating and he is now receiving palliative care. A spokeswoman for the Scottish Prison Service said inmates in the final stages of cancer were moved to hospital when they could no longer be treated in jail.quote>

Firstly, before people comment, the British Government have absolutely no say in the release of this man. Justice is devolved to Scotland and as such the Scottish Justice Secretary has the power to decide, not London. Secondly, I fully oppose it, I think it's utterly scandalous and a complete embrassment for the Scottish Government. I have always held the belief that should you be sentenced to life in prison then you die in prison.

Yeah is a rather varied picture, some people I've spoken to have an incredibly generous scheme where they pay little and others have horrendously expensive schemes. On thing I did find out which utterly shocked me was that if a patient dies or someone with outstanding medical bills, these are simply passed onto their relatives to pay. Is this true? If so I find that truly shocked and to be frank a perfect example of the greed which permeates the American health system. In the UK, if you die with debt, the debt dies with you.

I'm curious... What is the average monthly cost for Medical Insurance? I know various plans exists and people avail of employer assisted/sponsored schemes or private individual and family plans. I'm just looking for a rough guide, including co-pay conditions. I'd be very grateful

Gunman kills innocent people in America. Forgive me for not being shocked,.

Crown land is a designated area belonging to the Crown, the equivalent of an entailed estate that passed with the monarchy and could not be alienated from it.quote> Thus, belonging to the British Monarch and administered by the British Government, thus wholly illegal to sell it. Background In 2008, after members of the British parliament conducting a routine review of the administration received several reports of high-level official corruption in the Turks and Caicos,[13] then-Governor Richard Tauwhare announced the appointment of a Commission of Enquiry into corruption.[14] The same year, Premier Michael Misick himself became the focus of a criminal investigation after a woman identified by news outlets as an American citizen residing in Puerto Rico accused him of sexually assaulting her,[15] although he strongly denies the charge.[16] On Monday, 16 March 2009, the UK threatened to suspend self-government in the islands and transfer power to the new governor, Gordon Wetherell, over systemic corruption.[17] On 18 March 2009, on the advice of her UK ministers, Queen Elizabeth II issued an Order-in-Council giving the Governor the power to suspend those parts of the 2006 Constitution which deal with ministerial government and the House of Assembly, and to exercise the powers of government himself. The order, which would also establish an Advisory Council and Consultative Forum in place of the House of Assembly, would come into force on a date to be announced by the governor, and remain in force for two years unless extended or revoked.[18] On 23 March 2009, after the enquiry found evidence of "high probability of systemic corruption or other serious dishonesty", Misick resigned as Premier to make way for a new, unified government.[19] Politicians were accused of selling crown land for personal gain and misusing public funds.[20] The following day, Galmo Williams was sworn in as his replacement.[19][21] Misick denied all charges, and referred to the British government's debate on whether to remove the territory's sovereignty ... "tantamount to being re-colonized. It is a backwards step completely contrary to the whole movement of history."[20] Suspension and reactions On 14 August 2009 after Misick's last appeals failed, the Governor, on the instructions of the UK Foreign Office, imposed direct rule on the Turks and Caicos Islands by authority of the 18 March 2009 Order-in-Council. The islands' administration has been suspended for up to two years and power has been transferred to the British-appointed Governor, with the United Kingdom also stationing a supply vessel in between Turks and Caicos. Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign Affairs Chris Bryant said of the decision to impose rule, "This is a serious constitutional step which the UK Government has not taken lightly but these measures are essential in order to restore good governance and sound financial management."[22] The move was met with vehement opposition by the former Turks and Caicos government, with Misick's successor Williams calling it a "coup", and stating that, "Our country is being invaded and re-colonised by the United Kingdom, dismantling a duly elected government and legislature and replacing it with a one-man dictatorship, akin to that of the old Red China, all in the name of good governance."[22] Despite this, the civilian populace was reported to be largely welcoming of the enforced rule.[22] The British government stated that they intended to keep true to their word that the country would regain sovereignty in two years or less, and Foreign Office Minister Chris Bryant said that elections would be held in 2011, "or sooner".[23] Governor Wetherell stated that he would aim to "make a clean break from the mistakes of the past" and create "a durable path towards good governance, sound financial management and sustainable development". Wetherell continued to say that, "In the meantime we must all learn to foster a quality of public spirit, listen to all those who have the long-term interests of these islands at heart, and safeguard the fundamental assets of the Territory for future generations... Our guiding principles will be those of transparency, accountability and responsibility. I believe that most people in the Turks and Caicos will welcome these changes."[22]quote> From wiki....but gives an idea

Originally posted by: SkiGeek So . . . Britain has imposed direct rule over this "crown colony" but it isn't a takeover. Is there some reason why these "colonists" can't be left alone to run things however they want? The population is 60% Island nationals. How are they colonists in the first place? quote> Because they have proved incredibly inept at governing the islands with wholesale corruption and illegal selling of Crown Land. It's a'' explained in the article and and as Merlin stated, the UK inhabited the islands, there was never a native population. The UK acts to protects the interests of British Citizens, these people are all British citizens and have the right to corrupt-free rule and respect for their rights. That's why we imposed Direct Rule.

Originally posted by: fukuda The rest of the world, being so far behind us in so many areas, would love to have the field artificially leveled.quote> Yes, that must be the reason why quote> Yeah I know right...lol

Let's stop playing "My country is better than your country" and get back to the topic at hand.quote> No such game was being played. I was stating fact, the vast majority of immigrants into the United Kingdom are admitted after they have been assessed. Most find jobs relatively quickly and many are sourced abroad by UK companies, for such professions like plumbing and construction. The articles posted above give the other side of the story, did Americans fully expect the British, of which 92% are pleased with NHS delivery, to not defend their healthcare system. More so when the attacks were based in inaccuracies and republican hyperbole.? I'm fully aware that both systems have their advantages and their problems. I never stated anything to the contrary. Indeed in previous pages I have noted such things and given credit in regard to the American system where it is due.

Most people outside the US want to come here, poor villagers in the 3rd world do not while away their days dreaming of emigrating to Ireland or jolly old Englandquote> Third world villages aren't exactly a great economic asset to attract to the UK, so wouldn't bother me if they dreamed of living in the US. We tend to attract immigrants from somewhat more developed countries with attractive skills and a good level of education. It's about quality, not quantity. a country that, in overall terms, so completely eclipses yours that, without 'The Troubles', it would be easy to forget that Ireland even exists.quote> The Troubles....*yawn* Would seem you failed to remember that it was the initial wave of British and Irish immigrants that actually established settlements and were important in the development of American society. I highly doubt we would be so easily forgotten, certainly not by the millions of Americans that visit Ireland in search of their ancestsy. Also.....I wouldn't throw stones, denial of basic civil rights to blacks, coupled with state supported violent suppression anyone? Yes indeed Manticore, best you not attempt engage in such immature points, America is not exactly a shining beacon to the world now is it.

Cry me river Manticore...... Just goes to prove that when some Americans are faced with a reality they wish to ignore they go off on a rant and accuse everyone around them of Anti-Americanism, it's so incredibly tiresome and predicable. American Republicans were the instigators of a flawed campaign that spread lies and inaccurate statistics about the NHS. It's not our problem if you can't take criticism, it's also not our problem if you're so incredibly paranoid and insecure that you lash out at other people for exposing some brutally accurate facts that you wish to ignore. I have visited the US actually, many times and enjoyed it greatly. I'm not Anti-America, despite whatever you think, indeed on many occasions I've proved I'm more informed about America than some Americans seem to be. I find that rather depressing.

So yeah, as I suspected, it's less than in the US, and significantly so. Hence the shortage and "importing" issues. Because really, if you need to go to college for four years, medical school for another four years, and then three more years on top of that as an intern/resident working long hard hours making not a lot of money, so that you're nearly 30 years old and hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt by the time you can actually start practicing your profession... it had better pay damn good to be worth it. quote> UK doctors don't enter their profession hundreds of thousands in debt. They may in America, they don't here.

As for our media being full of drama and hyperbole, well...quote> There was nothing inaccurate in that article, unless you are denying that Americans that have been cast aside to die and suffer in pain do not have to queue for hours, and in cases days to avail of some medical treatment that is freely provided in almost every other developed civilised nation in the world. As for the American media, the NHS the breeding ground for terrorist?. Oh please, everyone outside America knows how much of a joke your 'news' channels are, complete laughing stock. As for the pay issue, medical care is not seen here as an avenue to gross profiteering. The simply ridiculous and greed driven nature of American healthcare is one of the major factors that has resulted in Americans spending more per head on healthcare than any other nation on the planet, yet have some of poorest health standards in the developed world.

This was obviously an editorial; with all due respect, if that's where this is going I have some 400+ articles on file that I can share with the thread. Mine have a perspective of those who live here and understand America, not the ramblings of some pedigreed pointy head in a totally different geographic region.quote> Perhaps you should direct that to your fellow countrymen. They seem to believe they are best placed to cast assertions on the healthcare system of another country. Then again, for them to actually admit to their own failings would be simply too horrendous to contemplate now wouldn't it? Best they stick to the 'Death Panel' B.S and continuing spewing wholly flawed rhetoric to a populace that in general knows no different. Rupert Cornwall: Known for his commentary on international relations and US politics, Rupert Cornwell also contributes obituaries and occasionally even a column for the sports pages. With The Independent since its launch in 1986, he was the paper's first Moscow correspondent - covering the collapse of the Soviet Union - during which time he won two British Press Awards. Previously a foreign correspondent for the Financial Times and Reuters, he has also been a diplomatic correspondent, leader writer and columnist, and has served as Washington bureau editor. In 1983 he published God's Banker, about Roberto Calvi, the Italian banker found hanging from Blackfriars Bridge.quote>

Rupert Cornwell: America needs to cool down The nonsense spewed out by the reform opponents can be breathtaking Saturday, 15 August 2009 Who will be the first American to lay down his life for (or against) healthcare reform? I'm serious. From a distance, the hysteria at politicians' town hall meetings these past two weeks across the US comes across as the theatre of the absurd. Except the show has featured a death threat to one congressman and a senator who asked for a special police guard when he took on his critics, as well as yelling crowds of supporters and opponents of reform accusing each other of being Nazis and communists. But are we not talking of comfort and healing? What on earth is going on? Of course there is an element of showbiz in proceedings. These are the dog days, and news-starved cable TV channels are playing the rough and tumble for all its worth. For every unruly meeting, there may be half a dozen perfectly civilised ones you hear nothing about. The weather doesn't help either. The hot and humid fag-end of the American summer is more than conducive to short temper. Come September, you would suppose, temperatures – both meteorological and emotional – should be cooler. As for the politicians who hold these meetings, they grin and bear it, insisting gamely that the ferocity of the debate only proves the vibrancy of the US political process. Related articles The brutal truth about America’s healthcare Leading article: The healthcare debate comes back across the Atlantic Christina Patterson: The big problem with the NHS isn't funding Second MEP defies Cameron with NHS attack If only it were so simple. How the argument will end no one can say. For what it's worth, my guess is that Congress will pass something; for the Democrats who control Capitol Hill and who have been entrusted with the job of writing the health reform legislation to deliver nothing to a Democratic president would be collective political suicide. But what emerges will probably be much less than Obama would like. In one respect, the hullabaloo is utterly normal. The way healthcare in America currently works may be morally wrong and financially unsustainable. But nothing is tougher than changing the familiar and the entrenched. The NHS in Britain, like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, the three pillars of America's state-run welfare and health structure, were all written on empty slates. Healthcare reform, as opposed to healthcare invention, has defeated every president since Harry Truman. However much is wrong with the system, the majority of the population who are covered are happy with what they've got. And even if they weren't, the vast vested interests – insurance companies, drug companies, hospitals and the like – that have grown fat from the healthcare status quo would be obstacle enough to change. Not surprisingly, these lobbies, as well as Republicans opposed to the Obama plan, have been accused of fomenting the town-hall uproar. If so, they are pushing on an open door. Deep down, America is a conservative country for whom change is frightening, especially change that involves, as healthcare reform inevitably will, a greater role for government. The Republican Party may be a dead man walking, but one baleful legacy of Ronald Reagan era survived the party's rout in the 2006 and 2008 elections: an almost reflex distrust of government. And Americans have had to put up with a lot of government recently: the rescue of the financial system, the reordering of the car industry, and a $800bn stimulus that will push the federal deficit to its highest level as a proportion of the economy since the First World War. Even so, the nonsense spewed out by reform opponents can be breathtaking. "Keep the government out of Medicare," screamed one protester the other day, overlooking the minor fact that 40 years ago it was the government that set up the hugely popular healthcare plan for the elderly. And upon such ignorance, deceit and naked scaremongering prey. Thus the talk of the "death panels" that would be run by federal bureaucrats, deciding whether ailing grandma would be treated or left to die. Thus the abuse that rains down upon the single-payer health systems of Canada and Britain, as examples of the "socialism", nay Stalinism, that awaits America should the public insurance option sought by reformers come into being. Yes, the "socialist" solution might be cheaper. But who could possibly wish to replace those tender and magnanimous for-profit insurance companies with heartless government? In reality, the debate has moved beyond healthcare, a fiendishly complicated subject which taxes the skills of even Barack Obama, that most masterly of explainers, to convey in easily understandable terms. It now embraces the entire relationship between the state and the individual in a battle of slogans about freedom, democracy and the American way. As a woman told Arlen Specter (the Democratic senator who requested the protection of the Capitol Police from Washington) at the meeting a few days ago in his home state of Pennsylvania, "This is about the systematic dismantling of this country." And when a country faces systematic dismantlement, do not its citizens have the right to use any means to save it? "Extremism in the defence of liberty is no vice" was how Barry Goldwater once put it. That, though, was back in the 1960s. Things are more violent now. Gunmen shoot dead doctors who carry out abortions, and guards who get in their way at the Holocaust Museum. For experts on the far right, these are worrying times. Hate groups are thriving, and far right "Patriot" militias are multiplying, according to a new report from the Alabama-based Southern Poverty Law Center, which monitors such organisations. The economy is in a mess; unemployment is rising and a "liberal" black man heads the federal government. Supposedly mainstream cable TV and talk radio hosts peddle the conspiracist fantasy that Obama is not American-born – and little different in fact from those illegal immigrants who already haunt the nightmares of paleo-conservatives. The National Rifle Association, spearhead of the gun lobby, is more formidable than ever. I'm not saying that the opposition at healthcare town halls comes from gun-toting survivalists who see black helicopters marked "World Government" circling overhead. But the American right is a spectrum of overlapping segments, and when the twigs and grass are dry, a match in the forest can start a fire. That's why I worry that healthcare reform could unwittingly produce a martyr – and why things may not calm down so quickly, even when the cooler days of September have come.quote>