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Plugin Conflicts and CTD

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  • Original Poster
  • I can't find a similar topic anywhere else. Someone please let me know if there is one elsewhere.  Has anyone started a list of known conflicts among the thousands of plugins available for SC4?  It is not feasible to unload the entire plugins folder and start adding them one by one to find conflicts, especially when CTD's can happen at any time (or no time?) so how long would you let a new city run before finding a conflict?  I find some posts about conflicts between seaport controllers but I have never found a list started of specific conflicts - if you use the CDK Seaport, don't use any plugin seaport from __________? 

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    I can't find a similar topic anywhere else. Someone please let me know if there is one elsewhere.  Has anyone started a list of known conflicts among the thousands of plugins available for SC4?  It is not feasible to unload the entire plugins folder and start adding them one by one to find conflicts, especially when CTD's can happen at any time (or no time?) so how long would you let a new city run before finding a conflict?  I find some posts about conflicts between seaport controllers but I have never found a list started of specific conflicts - if you use the CDK Seaport, don't use any plugin seaport from __________? 

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    The lots often interact with each other, so it isn't clear one can make and maintain "a list" .. what won't work for you may work for someone else. Your problem is twofold.. one.. I expect you downloaded a lot of stuff without knowing anything about it.. just to have "new stuff".. This means not only don't you know what you actually have, but means you have no idea as to how it is modeled or what its problems are. It actually takes little time.. had you read a few of these threads you'd see the "binary search" method of taking out half of YOUR specials.. does it work? yes=> go to other half, no=> half that "bad" set, and go with that.. within half an hour you'll have all of your problem lots isolated... far easier than trying to maintain a list of all lots made by all people on all SC4 sites all the time! 2.gif

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    The lots often interact with each other, so it isn't clear one can make and maintain "a list" .. what won't work for you may work for someone else. Your problem is twofold.. one.. I expect you downloaded a lot of stuff without knowing anything about it.. just to have "new stuff".. This means not only don't you know what you actually have, but means you have no idea as to how it is modeled or what its problems are. It actually takes little time.. had you read a few of these threads you'd see the "binary search" method of taking out half of YOUR specials.. does it work? yes=> go to other half, no=> half that "bad" set, and go with that.. within half an hour you'll have all of your problem lots isolated... far easier than trying to maintain a list of all lots made by all people on all SC4 sites all the time! 2.gif

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    just delete files you know you dont need and some of them may be the ones causing crashes. thats what i do and i almost never have mid game crashes. Even with 3 GB of plugins.

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    just delete files you know you dont need and some of them may be the ones causing crashes. thats what i do and i almost never have mid game crashes. Even with 3 GB of plugins.

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  • Original Poster
  • Thanks for the response.  You're right that part of the problem is not knowing anything about the plugin but it's because there isn't any info available.  Most descriptions will provide a list of any dependencies but I have never seen one that says, "If you use this plugin don't use _______"  (Except for the Seaports).  I understand what you are saying with a binary method of isolating conflicts but my point is that when you get a CTD it could be anything from a swapfile to memory to plugin conflicts, etc. (as you said what works for one may not work for another).  This is only an effective method if you group just the plugins being used in a city, then start halving them until you find a conflict if any. 

    My goal is to find some way of spending more time actually building cities and not half of my time just managing settings, files, menus and dependencies while reading through pages and pages of forums. 

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  • Original Poster
  • Thanks for the response.  You're right that part of the problem is not knowing anything about the plugin but it's because there isn't any info available.  Most descriptions will provide a list of any dependencies but I have never seen one that says, "If you use this plugin don't use _______"  (Except for the Seaports).  I understand what you are saying with a binary method of isolating conflicts but my point is that when you get a CTD it could be anything from a swapfile to memory to plugin conflicts, etc. (as you said what works for one may not work for another).  This is only an effective method if you group just the plugins being used in a city, then start halving them until you find a conflict if any. 

    My goal is to find some way of spending more time actually building cities and not half of my time just managing settings, files, menus and dependencies while reading through pages and pages of forums. 

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    Well, I have posted many times with advice about shot gun of plugins.  I suggest you start thinking about what you really need rather than what you want.  When I did that, I emptied by plugin folder and started over.  Just because some plugin sounds neat, doesn't mean you need it.  You have to control your wants, and only respond to needs.  This is part of growing up, by the way.

    So, what do you need.  There are several plugins that are actually fixes.  You need them.  You should also consider the NAM as needed because without it the vanilla game is rather dull.  I took the full NAM offering when v.29 came out.  I have since dropped RHW as being not for me.  I have a specific playing style, and I don't need the fiddley aggravation of all the civil engineering that comes with that package.  That is not to say that it might not be for you.

    Because I use a lot of surface mass transit, I added the RTMT and find that it helps me make a more sane city.  It has some caveats, so you want to read the documentation carefully.

    Because I like to do riparian cities, I have added several lots from PEG's site, and I reached back and took all the Goldiva lots that have to do with beach fronts.  Some of her landscaping help my beaches look great.  I like to have a beach community consisting of 1 x 1 lots spread around a diagonal street grouping with an occasional lot taken for a suburban bus stop.  I don't use on road for this, because it is inappropriate to the kind of thing I am building.  I particularly like PEG's garbage scow lots.  Definitely adds some realism to a waterfront.

    I work in regions, mostly.  So I generally have several cities on the go at one time.  I don't find switching back and forth to be a real task, just a chance to go get another refill on my ice water.

    One of the things that happens in a CTD is that the game dumps two garbage files in your exception reports folder.  They are no good to anyone but a developer, so clean them out regularly.  If you are a programmer, you might look at the first few lines of the .txt file, and find something out, but generally you need the load map, which you don't have.

    So, when you take out all your plugins, and you are testing, remember to ignore the "brown paper packages, tied up with string" which were obviously some one's favorite thing.

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    Well, I have posted many times with advice about shot gun of plugins.  I suggest you start thinking about what you really need rather than what you want.  When I did that, I emptied by plugin folder and started over.  Just because some plugin sounds neat, doesn't mean you need it.  You have to control your wants, and only respond to needs.  This is part of growing up, by the way.

    So, what do you need.  There are several plugins that are actually fixes.  You need them.  You should also consider the NAM as needed because without it the vanilla game is rather dull.  I took the full NAM offering when v.29 came out.  I have since dropped RHW as being not for me.  I have a specific playing style, and I don't need the fiddley aggravation of all the civil engineering that comes with that package.  That is not to say that it might not be for you.

    Because I use a lot of surface mass transit, I added the RTMT and find that it helps me make a more sane city.  It has some caveats, so you want to read the documentation carefully.

    Because I like to do riparian cities, I have added several lots from PEG's site, and I reached back and took all the Goldiva lots that have to do with beach fronts.  Some of her landscaping help my beaches look great.  I like to have a beach community consisting of 1 x 1 lots spread around a diagonal street grouping with an occasional lot taken for a suburban bus stop.  I don't use on road for this, because it is inappropriate to the kind of thing I am building.  I particularly like PEG's garbage scow lots.  Definitely adds some realism to a waterfront.

    I work in regions, mostly.  So I generally have several cities on the go at one time.  I don't find switching back and forth to be a real task, just a chance to go get another refill on my ice water.

    One of the things that happens in a CTD is that the game dumps two garbage files in your exception reports folder.  They are no good to anyone but a developer, so clean them out regularly.  If you are a programmer, you might look at the first few lines of the .txt file, and find something out, but generally you need the load map, which you don't have.

    So, when you take out all your plugins, and you are testing, remember to ignore the "brown paper packages, tied up with string" which were obviously some one's favorite thing.

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