What is the largest Stage-8 Building footprint?

[BlkMarine 0]

I'm a newbie, folks.  I've been playing SC4-RH for about 6 months now and have read/learned tons from all the posts so far.  I know I've only scratched the surface on this site though.  I've loaded the NAM and the Opera House fix mods only, so far.  But, I digress.  Here's my issue:

I'd like to plan my initial street/road layouts and zoning to accomodate my eventual goal of obtaining Stage-8 Buildings later in the game.

Based on my assumption that the max footprint size for those buildings are 5x5, my street configurations consist of 11x11 tile blocks.  This allows a 5x5 area on each corner and a 1-tile space at the mid-block for a bus stop.

Early in the game, while I zone R-LD, C-LD, and I-D, I am only using 3x3 tiles and am keeping the center unzoned.  I am adding a small park or small plaza at the very center of these blocks and filling the rest of the unzoned area with trees.  

My plan is to expand to 4x4 tiles for each zone when I upgrade to R-MD, C-MD, I-M, and then expand again to 5x5 tiles when I upgrade to R-HD, C-HD, and I-HT.  My theory is that the trees, parks and plazas will help control the inevitable pollution problem -- especially in my industrial area -- but, as I gain more high-tech, I can reduce the tree count while expanding the zones.

I've attached a screen shot of my proposed initial layout and welcome any comments, observations, or suggestions from you veterans.  

Thanks in advance for your inputs!

[McLolorzman 0]

In my opinion, I wouldn't use such a structured layout. Restricting your zones to very specific 3x3, 4x4, and 5x5... you're going to see the same buildings over and over and over again. To get the best diversity you need to mix and match zone sizes and densities (as well as load up on some of the great contributions to the STEX). Plus, a grid style as proposed will sent anything interesting the city may have about it down the toilet (in my opinion of course). And I would make commercial dominate my city center instead of industry as shown in the picture there.

These are just things I would do, though, but everyone's different. The important thing is to experiment and have fun.

[NetPCDoc 1]

Hello BlkMarine,

For the true maximum population in the least space - a grid system is the only logical solution; although most here at simtropolis tend for a more relaxed environment - one with pleasant vistas and less cramming of population.

As noted above - industry in the center isn't recommended; for aid in dealing with polution issues - industry is usually located on the outer edges of a city. Also - you probably don't want industrial rails (those accessed via Freight Stations) running though your commercial districts.

To get the most traffic, and thus increased demand for it, commercial tends to be placed in the center; and if you are planning for stage-8 buildings - you may want to allow for larger capacity avenues (and highway access).

BUT - Most Important:

Please don't forget - just because the building has a fixed footprint - doesn't mean that it won't go up on a larger lot. SimCity4 has a lot of puzzle pieces that the simulator likes to add in around the growable buildings - most giving a sublte hint as to the wealth of the building.

-NetPCDoc

No detail is too small to be micromanaged.

[BlkMarine 0]

Wow... already 2 responses within 1.5 hours!  Thanks for the inputs, McLolorzman and NetPCDoc!

I hadn't thought about the impact of industrial having on my city center until both of you mentioned it.  My initial theory was that the industrial would attract commuters and, if I limited their routes to just a few major avenues to get to those jobs, then put my commercial along those roads, that would provide a nice high-customer rating for each commercial zone.  Now that I've read your responses, I can see how that theory might work at the beginning of the game, but then work against me toward the middle and latter stages of growth.

Perhaps, as I rezone for larger densities, I'll gradually creep the commercial zones into the industrial area currently at the city center and relocate those industrial areas with new zones on the outer edges of the map.  I kinda like the sound of that strategy.

McLolorzman - Thanks for the diversity advice.  Being a military man (I really am a Marine), I'm afraid structure is an affliction I've suffered from since I first joined the service 10 years ago.  It's hard for me to break from nice square corners and perfect formations, but avoiding a boring town may be worth a try.  That said, I'll try to start my neighbor town with a little more creativity.

NetPCDoc - Thanks for the tip on industrial rails traveling through my commercial zones.  I didn't realize that would have a NIMBY affect until I read your response, but it makes sense that it would (I wouldn't want a view of freight trains from my office window).  I have indeed noticed that some of my high-wealth and medium-wealth C and R buildings have expanded  to fill additional space.  However, I want to ensure I've allotted enough space for the largest footprint buildings -- which is why I asked the initial question of what size is the largest-footprint building?  And, while I've got the issue on my mind, is there a space that could be considered too large (e.g., 6x6, 7x7, etc.)?  I realize that sims will only walk a certain distance to mass transit and I'd like to eventually replace those bus stops with tube stops (subway system) but I also don't want to unwittingly place them too far away.

Thanks again for the education from you folks!  I truly appreciate it!

[NetPCDoc 1]

As to too large - the main thing to remember - sims don't like to walk more than 10 tiles before getting to some other (non-walking) form of transit. The second thing to remember - is mass transit should be en-route to where they are going; sims don't usually (without a mod) go out of their way to utilize mass transit (and crossings - such as at intersections - reduce the said 10 tile limit). Which is my long-winded way of explaining why mass transit is better placed at corners/intersections - unless the block is large enough to need one or more stations, in addition to those, at the intersections.

When you discover Agriculture - remember - Agricultural Sims won't want parallel roads/streets closer than 10 tiles (preferrably 16+ tiles of seperation, when the farms are between said roads/streets).

Another way to go at this - only one side of a growable building must be within 8 tiles of a avenue/road/street, and out-lying props etc may fill the intervening 7 tiles - and up to another 7 tiles on the other side of the building.

And in the worst case of really zoning too large - your zones get re-parcel-ed - leaving the further (center?) parcels without transit access.  Until you re-think the between zones/parcels parks.

-NetPCDoc

No detail is too small to be micromanaged.

[BlkMarine 0]

Thanks again, NetPCDoc, for those additional tips.  That helps me better strategize on my mass transit placements.  It's good to know that I need only concern myself with one side of my growable buildings being within 8 tiles of a street/road/avenue.  I'll keep that in mind on my next grid layout.  My goal is to allow maximum room for any one growable building to gain its maximum size without allowing so much room that my mass transit stops will be too far for my sims to choose as their travel option.

You said that sims won't go out of their way too much to walk to mass transit and that they should be en-route to where they are going.  So, if my industry/commercial jobs are to the West of my sims home, then any bus stop I put to the East of their homes will be a waste of money as the sims will not bother to walk East to catch a bus to travel West.

Here's a question that just popped into my head:  When calculating travel time, does SimCity calculate the time it takes sims to walk to a Mass Transit stop into consideration?  In other words, would a 4-block walk + a 10-block bus ride = less travel time than a 7-block walk + a 10-block bus ride to the same destination?  Or does the calculator merely factor the bus-ride itself and not the walking distance?

Thanks again for the help!

[Dalewyn 2]

I believe the walking distance is factored into the commute time as, after all, walking is still a form of commuting to places close to your place of residence or station/stop of destination. I never really looked in-depth into it though, so I could be wrong. =X

[Voulpiotis 4]

The largest building footprint in SC4 is a downloadable residential lot (Hong-Kong Series) that is 12x9...