Stages

[Tickford 0]

Can someone please explain what the stages mean and how you can get buildings from that stage.
It's confusing when everyone is talking about stage 8 buildings, and I have downloaded some but they are not being built. Please explain why and the concept of stages???

[GaBoR 7]

Here are some articles that should be useful in this case:

https://www.simtropolis.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=147&threadid=75836&enterthread=y

https://www.simtropolis.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=110&threadid=69362&highlight_key=y&keyword1=stage https://www.simtropolis.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=38&threadid=60426&highlight_key=y&keyword1=stage

https://www.simtropolis.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=22&threadid=74608&highlight_key=y&keyword1=stage

Good luck!!!

[Peorth 17]

I recently discussed a bit about building stages here. The short of it is that building stages are a measure of how evolved or advanced a building is. Residential and commercial buildings have 8 stages while industrial has only 3.

To get higher-stage buildings, you need to meet the stage limits. These are fixed population levels that you need to get before the higher-stage buildings appear. The population is computed in a regional basis, i.e. the total of all your R§ + R§§ + R§§§ regionwide.

Below are the stage limits.

Residential Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 3,181

Stage 6: 9,086

Stage 7: 25,952

Stage 8: 43,859

Commercial Office (Co) Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 3,181

Stage 6: 9,086

Stage 7: 25,952

Stage 8: 43,859

Commercial Service (CS) Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 1,882

Stage 6: 5,376

Stage 7: 15,356

Stage 8: 57,017

Industrial Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 2,447

Notes

- the stage 1 limit is always 0 sims. That's why you start with purely stage 1 buildings until you meet the next stage level

- stage limits for residential and commercial office are identical

- stage limits for commercial service is identical to R and Co up to stage 4.

Reference: Simcity Central Knowledge Bin, data originally compiled by cracatoa, published 30 January 2006. All figures refer to regional sim population.

The discussion of stage limits is incomplete if you don't factor in the probabilities of getting buildings. Again, I discussed it a bit here.

Hope you learned something today!

[Tickford 0]

Originally posted by: Peorth I recently discussed a bit about building stages here. The short of it is that building stages are a measure of how evolved or advanced a building is. Residential and commercial buildings have 8 stages while industrial has only 3.

To get higher-stage buildings, you need to meet the stage limits. These are fixed population levels that you need to get before the higher-stage buildings appear. The population is computed in a regional basis, i.e. the total of all your R§ + R§§ + R§§§ regionwide.

Below are the stage limits.

Residential Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 3,181

Stage 6: 9,086

Stage 7: 25,952

Stage 8: 43,859

Commercial Office (Co) Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 3,181

Stage 6: 9,086

Stage 7: 25,952

Stage 8: 43,859

Commercial Service (CS) Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 507

Stage 4: 1,114

Stage 5: 1,882

Stage 6: 5,376

Stage 7: 15,356

Stage 8: 57,017

Industrial Stage Limits

Stage 1: 0

Stage 2: 300

Stage 3: 2,447

Notes

- the stage 1 limit is always 0 sims. That's why you start with purely stage 1 buildings until you meet the next stage level

- stage limits for residential and commercial office are identical

- stage limits for commercial service is identical to R and Co up to stage 4.

Reference: Simcity Central Knowledge Bin, data originally compiled by cracatoa, published 30 January 2006. All figures refer to regional sim population.

The discussion of stage limits is incomplete if you don't factor in the probabilities of getting buildings. Again, I discussed it a bit here.

Hope you learned something today! quote>

 

Thanks for that , very helpfull

[Keiran Halcyon 0]

Hmm... That isn't how the Prima guide reports things. Yes, the numbers agree, but according to the guide, your population in each category (R$, R$$, etc.) is checked individually. E.g., to get stage 7 CS buildings, you need at least 15,356 CS jobs. But Prima can be wrong.

The Prima guide also claims that these numbers were tweaked in Rush Hour, but only for R$, CS$, and ID, to allow earlier development of higher building levels. For example, under RH, you'd only need 9,571 R$ sims to get stage-8 R$ buildings. It also says that ALL these numbers are reduced to 91% at the medium difficulty level and 83% at hard. Again, Prima's numbers (and even their claims about "how things work") can be wrong, and I haven't looked at the data at SCC.

I might just go over to the modding requests thread and ask for a query mod that tells me what stage an RCI building is....

[Peorth 17]

Unfortunately, I was just paraphrasing what MadAngus from Simcity4.net posted, and oddly he also had the Prima guide! However, it seems there was more than one version of the guide; an older one covering SC4 vanilla and the newer one including RH. It seems MadAngus had the old one, and maybe that's the source of the discrepancy.

Keiran Halcyon, since your have the Prima guide, would these assumptions now be the correct ones?

1. The figures for the residential stage levels refer to sims per wealth class. e.g. for a stage 7 R§§ building you need at least 25,925 R§§ sims

2. The figures for the commercial and industrial stage levels actually refers to jobs and NOT population.

3. If #2 is correct and it refers to jobs, which of the following below is correct?

To get a Stage 7 Co§§§, I need:

a. 25,925 high-wealth commericial office jobs (Co§§§ )

b. 25,925 total commercial office jobs (Co§§ + Co§§§ )

c. 25,925 total commercial jobs (CS + Co)

4. The numbers are NOT city figures but refer to regionwide population and jobs

Incidentally, the tweaked numbers for R§ (9571 to get stage 8 R§ ) were discovered by Bones1 while looking through the exemplars of the data files.

[Keiran Halcyon 0]

Well, the guide I have (supposedly) is identical to the old guide, plus an addition of several new chapters covering RH and the various changes made (to the RCI model, to transit, etc.). The only parts that it claims were added in RH were that R$, CS$, and ID had their thresholds reduced to allow for earlier high-stage development of those categories, and the difficulty levels, of course. So, to andwer you point-by-point:

1) Yes.

2) Yes.

3) A. (Well, 29,952, you have a typo.) Each of the... 11?... developer types is counted seperately. (12 if these rules apply to IA, which is not clear.)

4) Prima is not clear on this, but it should be easy to set up an experiment to verify it one way or another. I would guess that it's region-wide, as long as the cities in question are connected.

Note that while the threshold tables are accurate to Prima's numbers, the tables in the book give a lot of info that the short table above leaves out. According to the guide, there is a stage breakdown that the simulator tries to maintain at each population bracket. For example, between 25,952 CO$$$ jobs and 33,378 CO$$$ jobs, the simulator tries to maintain 4%/8%/10%/28%/30%/18%/2%/0% CO$$$ population in each of the 8 stages. So yes, you can expect to see some CO$$$ stage 7 development, but not much. Given that the new buildings will hold more people than the old, though, you may be able to reach the next threshold to shift these percentages upward without zoning any more land. I'm not sure, but there may be a threshold (in terms of amount of zoned land) at which the city can develop to the maximum threshold (125,267 in all categories, except R$, CS$, and ID as changed in RH) without any further zoning. This will be more difficult the more diverse your city is, in terms of development types.

[Peorth 17]

Keiran Halcyon, thanks for your reply! At least things are clearer now.

Regarding the stage breakdown numbers, at least I think I got that one correctly in a separate thread. I referred to them as stage probabilities, and everytime a stage level is met there is a shift in the probablities towards more advanced developer types. It was good to learn about the I-D, R§ and CS§ modifications too; Bones1 encountered them in the exemplars and assumed that the stage probablities were also different per wealth level, since the values for the R§ stage 8 and R§§/R§§§ stage 8 were different. Now, it turns out that this was simply a modification specific only to I-D, CS§ and R§.

[Keiran Halcyon 0]

The stage probabilities, as you put it, are not changed per bracket; it's only the bracket boundries (ie, thresholds) that have been modified. So the category that I posted above applies to R$$, R$$$, CO$$, and CO$$$ for 25,952 to 33,378 sims (jobs), while R$ has the same breakdown for 6,647 to 7,976 sims.

Yes, I saw the other thread you posted in, but I haven't had time to read it yet.