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Fatjuice

SFTB Diagonal filler bug?

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If you mean the blue jagged edges, the only thing I know of that would fix that would be to turn on anti-aliasing which may mess up other parts of the game.

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That bug is nothing unusual at all. In fact, it is something that each and every lot with an overlay texture and a transparent base texture has in common: Once you go into underground view and back, the background grid shines through, or the transparent part appears as solid black. The bug is "hardwired" in the game's graphics engine and not related to any particular lot. IIRC, switching into zone view and back to normal will fix this visual glitch. However, it's been a long time since I last played the game...

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You don't have to go into underground view, it can happen while saving or zooming as well. It's a very common bug that I know by the name "water bug", because something similar happens to beach textures that go into the water.

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T Wrecks and Lost Realist are correct - that 'bug' results from using an overlay texture without a base texture.  The only way to create a filler lot like this ('water bug' free) would be to use the BAT and turn the overlay texture into an actual Prop (with the same texture).  You could then lay the prop down where the overlay texture should be and that should give you a decent diagonal filler, without the rip in the SC4 space-time continuum.

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A look at the Readme does give the reason (for what indeed is called the 'water bug') -

 

"This set also contains two lots with transparent base texture (courtesy by Nardo69). Unfortunately, there's a bug in the game that will cause it to display the blue background texture if you switch to underground mode and back (i. e. because you want to lay down some pipes). You can fix the display problem by switching to the zone view and back, though. If you don't want to deal with this bug at all, simply delete the two lot files that are labeled with "transparent" from your plugins folder."

 

Now, just for the record - switching to zone view and back (or re-loading, or whatever) will not "solve" this issue... the bug will re-appear as soon as you repeat certain actions (e.g. going underground, zooming etc.), so at best you can "solve" it temporarily.

 

To fix the issue permanently you have to fix the lotting mistake.

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some guidance to do so?

 

Download and install the Lot Editor (available on the Stex).

Familiarize yourself with the interface, maybe read through some tutorials - I wrote this one, but there are a number to be found.

 

Then open the lot in question, add in a suitable base texture and save. This is about the most basic and simple lotting exercise you can find. :yes:

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Well, the thing is: It is no mistake. These lots are meant to have a transparent base texture. That's their entire (and only) point, the reason for their existence. They have been made for no other purpose than to be transparent on one side so you can make a smooth diagonal transition to whatever terrain lies beneath - be it desert, rock, sand, or grass of any colour, pattern, texture, and appearance.

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These lots are meant to have a transparent base texture.

 

Oh sure, I understand the idea behind it... but here it gets sort of philosophical... ;-) 

 

Fact is - LE will not let us save a lot that does not have a base texture.

 

Now us modders know we can get around that by pulling base textures using the Reader. Usually --as long as we do not use an overlay texture at the same time-- that works just fine. However, if we do pull the base texture but still leave an overlay texture, we trigger the waterbug. Is it okay to knowingly trigger a bug just to achieve a certain effect? 

 

Again, a bit philosophical, maybe... but totally against my grain :-)

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I've noticed with these particular lots that an occasional "zoom in" will bring back SOME of the transparent texture, removing the background grid, but like I said, it seems to be only certain ones.

 

I've even tried to raise/lower the individual tile the puzzle piece sits on in an attempt to test the theory of a possible elevation lvl that would allow it to keep the plugins integrity.... nothing worked.

 

IWas never able to find a solution when I searched for one a few months back, so just started using the (pasture) pieces instead. It's not so noticeable with the default terrain texture, but would probably be a bit more so with your particular texture.

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These lots are meant to have a transparent base texture.

 

Oh sure, I understand the idea behind it... but here it gets sort of philosophical... ;-) 

 

Fact is - LE will not let us save a lot that does not have a base texture.

 

Now us modders know we can get around that by pulling base textures using the Reader. Usually --as long as we do not use an overlay texture at the same time-- that works just fine. However, if we do pull the base texture but still leave an overlay texture, we trigger the waterbug. Is it okay to knowingly trigger a bug just to achieve a certain effect? 

 

Again, a bit philosophical, maybe... but totally against my grain :-)

 

Maybe not so much philosophical as depending on application and preference. It's a simple trade-off: Gain possibilities you wouldn't have otherwise, at the cost of dealing with a graphical glitch.

 

If you choose to go down this route, you might as well lift your accusing finger against none other than Maxis themselves. Why? Because they included beaches in the game, and as we all know, building a beach also triggers the dreaded water graphics bug to happen - in fact, this very circumstance is where it got its name from. Now if you raise it to a philosophical question, aren't Maxis bad guys for offering beaches - or the player for placing them? Knowingly triggering a bug? IMO, that's jazzing it up a  bit too far.

 

You make it sound as if a sinister circle of evil modders hid awful secrets in their downloads, plunging innocent players into certain disaster and even taking delight in it. I can almost see Nardo69 stroking the Persian cat sitting in his lap and laughing his evil villain laughter. 

 

All that really happens is what I said: The lots open up one possibility, at the cost of a glitch that is entirely visual, easy to work around, and does not affect the game mechanics at all. To top it off, it's all explicitly and openly stated in the readme that everyone can (and, in fact, should) read before installing or using downloads, and those who don't like the trade-off can delete the lots in question and decide not to use them without the slightest drawback, cost, hassle, problem, or consequence. Not much drama involved, as far as I am concerned.

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You could always use a base texture that blends with your terrain.  Granted, it won't work well with terrain mods that have many textures, but you could also make a few different lots with different textures.

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IWas never able to find a solution

 

Because there is no real solution :-)  Maybe it helps if you imagine the textures as layers -

 

Layer 1 is the basic purple grid - that is everywhere, always...

Layer 2 are basic terrain textures - they 'cover' complete tiles on the 1x1 grid...

Layer 3 are overlay textures - they 'cover' the basic terrain textures (Layer 2), but can have transparent areas (so the basic terrain texture can be seen in parts).

 

That is still a bit simplified, but you can see that if you just leave out Layer 2 there will be something missing ;-)

 

 

 

You make it sound as if a sinister circle of evil modders hid awful secrets in their downloads

 

Jeez... what toes did I step on here? Obviously the OP has never encountered this problem, I'm just trying to clear up a few apparent misconceptions about what this age-old 'bug' is all about. Because only if people know what it is and where it comes from can they deal with it in a manner that suits them - e.g. deciding for themselves wether they want to use such lots or not.

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Because there is no real solution :-)  Maybe it helps if you imagine the textures as layers -

 

Layer 1 is the basic purple grid - that is everywhere, always...

Layer 2 are basic terrain textures - they 'cover' complete tiles on the 1x1 grid...

Layer 3 are overlay textures - they 'cover' the basic terrain textures (Layer 2), but can have transparent areas (so the basic terrain texture can be seen in parts).

 

That is still a bit simplified, but you can see that if you just leave out Layer 2 there will be something missing ;-)

 

 

This is certainly the first thread I've come across (simply cause it didn't exist more than a couple days ago) that gave a definite "no fix" to the problem. Although, as it's mentioned, those more versed in modding could probably remedy the issue themselves.

 

Since only opening the LE a couple times (without much fruition), I can sort of understand what you're speaking about with the layers.

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One fix I have used in the past is to install a background that has your terrain in it, because it will show your background instead of the grid. I used to have an awesome grass background that blended perfectly, but I installed something else that conflicts with it now, and have never been motivated enough to do anything about it, hehe

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One fix I have used in the past is to install a background that has your terrain in it, because it will show your background instead of the grid. I used to have an awesome grass background that blended perfectly, but I installed something else that conflicts with it now, and have never been motivated enough to do anything about it, hehe

Maybe try:

1. Creating a new folder named "zzzz" at the root of your plugins.

2. Placing the background in this folder.

This should avoid any conflicts by loading the background afterwards.

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Ill try it but aren't you supposed to put your background files in the root program directory, and not the mydocuments file path? I think the conflict arose when I installed the new NAM. I don't think it's the NAM, never, but it's not like I'd install the background over the most essential mod ever! : )

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