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ReshiramLover

all my water plants stopped producing water!

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All my water plants have stopped producing water to the city!!! I have like FOUR water production plug-ins plopped in the city that produce and filters the MAXIMUM a BAT can produce but NONE of them are producing ANY water!!! my funding for water is maxed out!!! this started happening in ALL cities with the plopmatic9000 in them!!!

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Remove the Plopmatic 9000. Do things return to normal?

On a sidenote, the Plopmatic uses some pretty extreme numbers to accomplish what it does - the simulator is known to get confused when plugins use outrageous numbers. It might not be good to keep it, period.

Now, if your water cleaning plugins use outrageous numbers, as well, it's possible they ended up breaking the pollution simulation and are accomplishing the exact opposite of your intended goal.

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  • Original Poster
  • Remove the Plopmatic 9000. Do things return to normal?

    On a sidenote, the Plopmatic uses some pretty extreme numbers to accomplish what it does - the simulator is known to get confused when plugins use outrageous numbers. It might not be good to keep it, period.

    Now, if your water cleaning plugins use outrageous numbers, as well, it's possible they ended up breaking the pollution simulation and are accomplishing the exact opposite of your intended goal.

    I demolished ALL plopmatic9000s and water problem persists!!! I waited three sim months!!!

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    1: Nuke the custom water plants you're using. Replace them with Maxis water plants, or this which hasn't caused me any problems.

    2: Nuke the custom water filtration facilities you're using. The linked plant filters water, too.

    Do things return to normal? If the above steps fixed your problem, NAME and LINK to the lots that you were using.

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  • Have you analyzed why they stopped their production? A certain level of pollution jams the water pumps...

    This is what I was going to say.

    they are my own custom creation plants... They produce the MOST and clean THE MOST that BATs allow!!! I NEVER had problem with them before!!! I've used them for at least a year!!!

    here is my issue.... yNQHK.jpg

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  • I think I figured out what the problem was... for some odd reason, the plant stops working if I drag funding past the 100% line!!! I maxed out the funding and it started producing again once I dragged it back to the 100% line...

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    Ah, I think I see the core of the problem: you've hit a technical limit.

    The pattern you see means that your plant is so overpowered, you've hit the overflow point where the number simply becomes too big to handle for a 32-bit number assignment to be positive. and flips from positive to negative (the first digit of both 16-bit and 32-bit numbers is the positive/negative flag). You see, there's a limited amount of data available for each number. Since SimCity 4 is a 32-bit application, it can store numbers that take up 32-bits or lower (usually powers of two, like 16-bit or 8-bit). Each bit can either be 0 or 1. This means you can store a number as large as 2 to the 32nd power (232), or 4294967296, because you have that many combinations you can make with 32 bits. However, when your number has a positive-negative flag, you can only get values half that size on either side (adding them up still makes 232), so your number ranges from -2147483647 to +2147483648 which is by the way 231.

    It looks like your water production is larger than 214748648 units (way, way more than you will ever need) so it flips from positive to negative and it will approach to zero. Most digital number assignments work that way. They are either positive integer only or they have this kind of positive/negative split.

    Anyway, that's computer science 101 ;)

    Best,

    Maarten

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  • The OP has three threads current about trouble with plugins. How about something external? Like a virus?

    a virus would not affect plug-ins!! and I HAVE a good AV and people create viruses wouldn't give a sh** about Sim City 4 plug-ins!!! it may be because my plug-ins folder is... 4GB!!!

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    Well, I'm kinda nonplussed by your numbers... you show a town of 14.000 souls with a 92 million water usage? Which lot sucks up such an extreme amount of water? In my book that's a bad mod...

    Also wondering - from the look of your interface - could it be that you are playing with a vanilla version (not Rush Hour)?

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    Well, I'm kinda nonplussed by your numbers... you show a town of 14.000 souls with a 92 million water usage? Which lot sucks up such an extreme amount of water? In my book that's a bad mod...

    Also wondering - from the look of your interface - could it be that you are playing with a vanilla version (not Rush Hour)?

    He's playing with Rush Hour, just in 800x600.

    The usage is related to the Integer overflow.

    ----

    Ah, I think I see the core of the problem: you've hit a technical limit.

    The pattern you see means that your plant is so overpowered, you've hit the overflow point where the number simply becomes too big to handle for a 32-bit number assignment to be positive. and flips from positive to negative (the first digit of both 16-bit and 32-bit numbers is the positive/negative flag). You see, there's a limited amount of data available for each number. Since SimCity 4 is a 32-bit application, it can store numbers that take up 32-bits or lower (usually powers of two, like 16-bit or 8-bit). Each bit can either be 0 or 1. This means you can store a number as large as 2 to the 32nd power (232), or 4294967296, because you have that many combinations you can make with 32 bits. However, when your number has a positive-negative flag, you can only get values half that size on either side (adding them up still makes 232), so your number ranges from -2147483647 to +2147483648 which is by the way 231.

    It looks like your water production is larger than 214748648 units (way, way more than you will ever need) so it flips from positive to negative and it will approach to zero. Most digital number assignments work that way. They are either positive integer only or they have this kind of positive/negative split.

    Anyway, that's computer science 101 ;)

    Best,

    Maarten

    Yeah, Integer Overflow.

    <begin very technical description>

    The amount of water your city has (before, during and after usage calculations) is stored as a Signed 32-Bit Int (BTW, the game can actually handle 64-Bit numbers, it does something weird with them so they work on a 32 Bit system, probably storing one half as a Signed Int and the other as an Unsigned 32-Bit int) which looks like this: 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 0000 (That's 0.)

    The problem is, the very first bit (digit) in an unsigned integer is used for an additional power of 2. You have ((n*2)-1) the number of positive numbers of a Signed Int that you can store, at the cost of not being able to store Negative numbers.

    In a Signed integer, that first bit is used to tell if the number is positive or negative, at the cost of half the possible positive numbers you can store, but you gain an almost equal amount in Negative (You gain exactly an equal amount if you use Two's Complement, though I highly doubt that the game is programmed this way).

    Computers do a funny thing, when a number is larger than what can be stored, it does what's called Overflow. Basically, any numbers which require more bits than there are in the Int have Powers of 2 removed until they fit. If you have the number 0010 1011 0100 1111 0010 0110 1100 0111 1110 (11,625,720,958 by the way), bits will be removed from the front until it fits. That means that it'll instead be stored as 1011 0100 1111 0010 0110 1100 0111 1110, which in an Unsigned Int is 3,035,786,366 (8,589,934,592 less than the original number), but in a Signed int is -888,302,718 (12,514,023,676 less) since the first digit is 1.

    You see the problem that the game faces when you give it too much, forcing it to increment that first bit?

    I'd drop the production to something reasonable (Like about an eighth of what it is).

    Also, Reshiram eh? I prefer Zekrom :P

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    The OP has three threads current about trouble with plugins. How about something external? Like a virus?

    a virus would not affect plug-ins!! and I HAVE a good AV and people create viruses wouldn't give a sh** about Sim City 4 plug-ins!!! it may be because my plug-ins folder is... 4GB!!!

    This is a standard "Nonny Moose" question when you have several seemingly unrelated subjects. The eventual questions are:

    1. Is your AV signature file current?

    2. When did you run disk cleanup last?

    3. When did you run disk defragmenter last?

    A 4GB plugin folder is nothing to brag about. How much of that is non-plugin material like readme files, pictures, etc. If you have 4GB of real plugins, where are you going to put them? The game can at most access 3GB total space as is uses 32-bit addressing. It really sounds like you need to reduce the junk in the plugin space, and keep the "documentation" some place else.

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  • Original Poster
  • The OP has three threads current about trouble with plugins. How about something external? Like a virus?

    a virus would not affect plug-ins!! and I HAVE a good AV and people create viruses wouldn't give a sh** about Sim City 4 plug-ins!!! it may be because my plug-ins folder is... 4GB!!!

    This is a standard "Nonny Moose" question when you have several seemingly unrelated subjects. The eventual questions are:

    1. Is your AV signature file current?

    2. When did you run disk cleanup last?

    3. When did you run disk defragmenter last?

    A 4GB plugin folder is nothing to brag about. How much of that is non-plugin material like readme files, pictures, etc. If you have 4GB of real plugins, where are you going to put them? The game can at most access 3GB total space as is uses 32-bit addressing. It really sounds like you need to reduce the junk in the plugin space, and keep the "documentation" some place else.

    #1... my AV updates every 24 hours!!!

    #2... I delete all documentation and pictures that come packed in plugins...

    #3... I use datpacker on all plugins

    #4... if you were paying attention I figured out the problem to the water and garbage... all I need to do is figure out the issue with the 'no traffic' mod!!!

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    Datpacker, eh? Well I hope you have done more than set up a single .dat file for your plugins. Anything NAM and NAM-related should not be datpacked.

    Now how do you update the .dat file when some lot in the file gets updated or changed?

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