Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
A Nonny Moose

Ever wonder what defines a Canadian?

214 posts in this topic Last Reply

Recommended Posts

Besides the city of Montreal I don't think that French will "die" out in the province of QC quickly, because everywhere else in the province, immigrants speak french and even don't really have a chance not to do so. I live in the Eastern Townships, which used to be more english than french 45 to 50 years ago. With time, most Anglophones moved out (Ontario) and were replaced with Francophones. Today the Townships are of french majority and I hardly see or hear english anymore in its capitol, the Town of Sherbrooke. If I want to speak english in Quebec then I have to go to Montreal, a 3 hour drive from here.

French seems to be a more complicated language to learn for foreigners and therefore most immigrants to Quebec stay in or around Montreal where they still speak a lot of english, which by means is a lot easier to learn, if not the easiest language of them all.

It will take a lot of time (many years and generations) before the french language will be "tossed" over here in Qc.

Personnally I don't care, I speak 7 languages fluently (because of my descendance and experience), including Mohawk ( a North-American Native language, still spoken in aborigine's reservations such as Khanasatake and Khanawake in Quebec). I don't really know much about the situations in other provinces, probably because I was never really interested, but one thing I know when I go to Ontario, Ottawa and Toronto, there is hardly anyone left there that speaks english without an accent of some kind.......lol. I was in Toronto last week, in a shopping mall near downtown, and all I saw was islamic, indian, (from India), african and asian origins of people on a friday afternoon. For me it was unbelievable to understand, and never seen before neither, not even in Montreal, how come that Canada seems to have more immigrants from these ethics than "Canadians" (caucasians)....? I felt sooo "white" as a German/Swedish origin all of sudden....lol...and so alone. ;)

But, as a matter of facts, here in America (including the US, South and Mexico) we all are immigrants, even the Natives and First Nations, which either came by boat (South America) or by the frozen over Berring straights one day or the other.

I will not live that North-America will loose its major languages such as English and French, and I don't really care for it neither, as long as we all understand each other and can communicate in peace.

Fred/mrb

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Original Poster
  • Interesting that you think that Bill 101 will keep French alive in Quebec. What it is keeping alive is the Quebecois dialect (Joual) which is difficult for anyone from France (Langue d'Oui, Paris; Langue d'Oc, Aquitane) to understand. In spite of the great efforts of l'Acadamie Français to propagate le Langue d'Oui to all of the Francophonie world wide, dialects remain. Even in New Brunswick, our only constitutionally bilingual province, the French spoken there is Acadian.

    I am sad that some of the Aboriginal languages are dying out. The College I retired from has a program for Ojibway speakers. You have to be fluent to get into it. Hang on to your Mohawk, and teach it to your kids. There are some programs in the western provinces to revive some of the languages in the areas where only the elders speak it now. How successful it will be seems moot.

    Meanwhile, if you live in Toronto you should brush up your Mandarin, Cantonese and Haklo.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Meanwhile, if you live in Toronto you should brush up your Mandarin, Cantonese and Haklo.

    lol......I'm a little too old now to learn new languages, but to be honest, I would have loved Mandarin or Cantonese, even russian and arabic.

    No, actually I believe that Bill 101 will stay alive for a long time in Quebec and encourage the french speaking community. True that Quebecois (the french here in Quebec) is somewhat unique(.....pis on est fier de c'la....) so is the Acadian from NB and as you said, it's maybe because of this that it will stay alive for a longtime. I actually like that language and understand it much better than the actual french from France, with which I have some serious difficulties sometimes. Of course I live in a very "quebecois" region in Quebec and that makes it my third best spoken language after German and Mohawk, and because I travel a lot with my job (loghome designer), english and swedish are fourth and fith languages of mine.

    No, I didn't teach my kids the Mohawk language, although some words and even phrases they do remember. They didn't like to speak other languages, but all three boys (in the early thirties) speak fluently french and english. Btw, my wife is quebecoise.

    I have no realation to Mohawks at all, but I speak very well the language. I am from a Swedish/German Father and a German/Hungarian/Dutch Mother. No Northamerican Native blood in me, but....I stayed with a Mohawk family for 3 years in the early seventies and I learned their language and a lot of other things that changed my life. May I add that Mohawks hardly ever drink alcohol and therefore are not drugged like many Abenakis, Crees and Inuits from Quebec.

    BTW, the pure "white race" will one day be on the endangered list, so will be their languages from the germanic (english/ german/ dutch/ swedish etc) to the roman related languages (french/ italian/ spanish etc), it will be the races that reproduce so much that will finish off humanity and their planet one day. ;) I and all of you out there now will be dead by then, unless they find the longlife pill soon. ;)

    Fred/ mrb

    Did you know that there are more people out there that speak chinese than there are english, german, french, italian and spanish all together?

    Hard to believe when you travel and look around........they are almost all in one place.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    In this side of the world the picture of Canada is that country at the north of United States, mostly cold and with a lot of forests, where the people supposed to be more friendly than the USA.


      Edited by Alejandro24  

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    where the people supposed to be more friendly than the USA.

    That, and more laid back.

    An example: my cousin and I were looking to get breakfast at a restaurant in Toronto, but it was crowded and we had to wait in line for a table. For half an hour, the line did not move, and everyone on line was still the whole time standing there smiling, chatting, and just generally being extremely patient and not really reacting to the situation. In the same situation in New York, meanwhile, you would have everyone getting restless and complaining, demanding to know what the hell is taking so long, getting fed up and leaving, etc.

    Of course, New York is particularly more high strung and neurotic (and rude) than the rest of the US, but Canada is even further removed from that than, say, Kentucky.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    "Vancouver was a part of the United States where the people were so clever that they never paid taxes to Washington" - Robert A. Heinlein

    Seems to me to be one of his weirder quotes. Why Vancouver in particular? And Canada is obviously not part of the United States. Even if Americans can't recognize a Canadian when they see one.

    One of my cousins lives in Montreal and married a local woman (what's the word -- Quebecois?). Their son is growing up bilingual but tells his father he is not allowed to speak French. He is only 3 so he often speaks a French sentence with an English word in it or visa versa.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Hey, that's a great idea, a good Timmy tomorrow morning. Can't now, 'caus I live like 30 km's away from the next town........:(

    Canada is very pacific, I mean we accept all kinds of folks from all kinds of countries and regions, even accept their religions and customs, plus the nagging and complaining about this and that all the time, (although they stay here). Do you think Paradise could be better?

    ;)

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Do you think Paradise could be better?

    ;)

    Well, it could be a little warmer. :P

    Canada, and it's nice people, fit into the climate theory of social upheaval. Basically, it says that people who live in cold weather areas are laid back and easy to get along with while people who live in hot weather areas are cranky and contentious.

    A generalization, obviously; one that has a few flaws. But it does seem to fit in many cases.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
  • Original Poster
  • Of course, the immigrants aren't the only ones who complain.

    Each province has brouhaha's with all the others. The PQ wants to separate and makes a big fuss, but Quebecers know which side of the bread the butter is on. BC is envious of all that royalty income in Alberta and is scheming to get a hunk of it.

    All the ethnic peoples have some angst with respect to other ethnic groups including the native peoples, and us early colonists.

    But somehow it never goes really very far, and it all comes out in the wash.

    There is one thing you must never do with Canadians. If you back us into a corner, we will fight like a cornered beaver.

    The official motto of Canada is "Peace, Order and Good Government". Generally we achieve the first two, but the last is usually moot.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Well, is totally natural to acclaim the place of origin. But I've heard (and readed in the internet too) a lot of cases of ill-treat to the mexicans in Canada. An introduction, the concentration of mexican people in Canada are located over Montreal and Vancouver. And since this situation of the country from 2006 the migration to Canada started, but the canadian government started to deport since 2009 and started to impose visas to visit the country (and vice-versa? Ja! Nothing changes). The situation is that many requests of politic asylum and for tourist were rejected, started the deportations and, well, the situation is still the same than US.

    Now the point is, I know perfectly that some requests of politic asylum are a fraud, but there are some that are reality.

    By the way, one of my teachers -Real Analysis- told me that he went to Canada -Montreal- the past summer only for vacation. He had the thick accent when he speaks in english. And he told be that the people there treated him very badly.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    By the way, one of my teachers -Real Analysis- told me that he went to Canada -Montreal- the past summer only for vacation. He had the thick accent when he speaks in english. And he told be that the people there treated him very badly.

    Probably had something to do with him speaking English. Montreal generally isn't too bad about this (though it depends on the neighborhood), but some people in Quebec will not like you if you don't speak French, regardless of where you come from.

    As for Tim Hortons, yes, they are all over the place up there. But visitors to Canada thinking they will get a distinctly Canadian experience at one will be disappointed to learn that it's really no different than Dunkin Donuts in the US.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    I have to drink Timmys to be Canadian?

    *Crumples citizenship application and throws it in the wastebasket.*

    No, the rules are different for you. For you, the requirement is to, sincerely and without forethought, say "I reckon so, eh?"

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites
  • Original Poster
  • Alejandro, you must not take the particular and generalize from it. Unless you are a Francophone any place in Quebec is a poor place to visit, especially if you have no French at all. Montreal is generally more cosmopolitan, but there are areas where French is de rigeur. I haven't been in Montreal for nearly 30 years, but I don't imagine it has changed except perhaps, due to Bill 101 which requires one to speak French in business situations anywhere in Quebec.

    A heavy Hispanic accent would also be a liability in Montreal, but not in Toronto. Unless your professor was visiting one of the three Universities in Montreal, he might well have had a bad time.


      Edited by A Nonny Moose  

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    *pic of Timmies cup cropped*

    I'm staring at an empty one of those on my desk right now... it's taunting me. :P

    I have to drink Timmys to be Canadian?

    *Crumples citizenship application and throws it in the wastebasket.*

    Wait, wait wait... you don't go to Timmies?! (Kidding! Obviously not everyone does... or they'd have 100% market share instead of "just" 80%.) :P

    Haha, truth be told, I am somewhat an addict. I know what my total should be for coffee and muffin or coffee and doughnut, even for the various coffee sizes. :P

    ===

    Generally, the more tourisy areas of Montreal are accepting of English speaking. Seeing as several businesses would depend on tourist dollars, this makes sense. Wouldn't want to chase them away. Other parts, on the other hand, are not. It really does depend which part of the city you are in, and the person.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Guys...

    ...

    I think Dirk is Tim Horton.

    Ehmmm... no astronelson, that's the signature of Dirk. He made the signature, not the coffee.

    um . . . I think he is referring to making the website . . .

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    I have to drink Timmys to be Canadian?

    *Crumples citizenship application and throws it in the wastebasket.*

    Wait, wait wait... you don't go to Timmies?! (Kidding! Obviously not everyone does... or they'd have 100% market share instead of "just" 80%.) :P

    Haha, truth be told, I am somewhat an addict. I know what my total should be for coffee and muffin or coffee and doughnut, even for the various coffee sizes. :P

    ===

    Okay, I have at least a partial excuse. I can't drink coffee much for one thing, as it gives me seizures. (A cup once in a rare while is okay though.) For the rest of it... Their "doughnuts" are baked. That, my friends, is not a doughnut. It's a cake with a hole in it. If it ain't fried, it ain't a doughnut. :)

    I'm okay with their hot cocoa though. Sandwiches aren't bad either.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Alejandro, you must not take the particular and generalize from it. Unless you are a Francophone any place in Quebec is a poor place to visit, especially if you have no French at all. Montreal is generally more cosmopolitan, but there are areas where French is de rigeur. I haven't been in Montreal for nearly 30 years, but I don't imagine it has changed except perhaps, due to Bill 101 which requires one to speak French in business situations anywhere in Quebec.

    A heavy Hispanic accent would also be a liability in Montreal, but not in Toronto. Unless your professor was visiting one of the three Universities in Montreal, he might well have had a bad time.

    Basically the ting that he found shocking (and also I found it as shocking too) is the effort for the treating of foreign people. We as a people who lives in a touristic country, we must too put a lot of effort trying to understand and treating correctly the foreing people , we appreciate that they come here. But in that case is just simply unfair and disrespectful, we must to treat correctly your tourists, why can't you to give the same respect?

    I try to keep it as a particular, but when I see this kind of issues is inevitable to think that we're giving too much of us and receiving not too much of human value. In my particular opinion, tourism is important, but there is a point when it becomes cancer.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Canada, and it's nice people, fit into the climate theory of social upheaval. Basically, it says that people who live in cold weather areas are laid back and easy to get along with while people who live in hot weather areas are cranky and contentious.

    So right, just look at where most of the "human troubles" are today, everywhere where it is warmer. It goes around the planet like a belt.

    The PQ wants to separate and makes a big fuss, but Quebecers know which side of the bread the butter is on.

    Well, actually it is seen a little exagerated by other Canadians. Quebec will not separate, there's only a small percentage of some fanatic francophones who think that it would be better. Most of the francophones are against it, those who don't speak out most of the times.

    Alejandro, you must not take the particular and generalize from it. Unless you are a Francophone any place in Quebec is a poor place to visit, especially if you have no French at all. Montreal is generally more cosmopolitan, but there are areas where French is de rigeur. I haven't been in Montreal for nearly 30 years, but I don't imagine it has changed except perhaps, due to Bill 101 which requires one to speak French in business situations anywhere in Quebec.

    First of all, some Mexicans are known here as low down thieves, hard workers though, but which steal a lot. I myself as a farmer hired 8 Mexican citizens 3 years ago for the harvesting season, as many farmers up here in the Eastern Townships do every year. Unfortunetly, once they left, many things on the farm turned up missing. I can somehow understand them, but only a few individuals can sometimes stirr up a false image of another country or ethnic. Generally though, we like them because they are friendly and excellent manual workers. And I 've got to give it to them, they are always on time!

    Then, Quebec is a nice place to visit and yes, A Nonny Moose, it has changed a lot since 30 years. Those fanatics are less around within the publics now. Montreal is a little different than most of the province though, maybe because of all the mixed ethnics present, but telling us where you're from, Quebecers welcome strangers generally with the french hospitality. Quebec City is also the closest to a European City in North America, being also the only one that has a castle. If you don't have the finances to go to Europe, than Quebec is the best next thing.

    Alejandro.....

    But in that case is just simply unfair and disrespectful, we must to treat correctly your tourists, why can't you to give the same respect? ....In my particular opinion, tourism is important, but there is a point when it becomes cancer.

    You are talking about one or maybe two cases, like I said above that some farmers have experienced bad cases with the workers. And don't forget, that "cancer" (tourism) keeps a country alive and wealthy, take that away and the wealth of one country changes dramatically if it doesn't have many natural ressources. ;)

    I'm not Canadian, got nothing to do with them neither, but I live here, I like it and to me it is one of the better, safer and more stable nations to live in today.

    mrb


      Edited by mrbisonm  

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    First of all, some Mexicans are known here as low down thieves, hard workers though, but which steal a lot. I myself as a farmer hired 8 Mexican citizens 3 years ago for the harvesting season, as many farmers up here in the Eastern Townships do every year. Unfortunetly, once they left, many things on the farm turned up missing. I can somehow understand them, but only a few individuals can sometimes stirr up a false image of another country or ethnic. Generally though, we like them because they are friendly and excellent manual workers. And I 've got to give it to them, they are always on time!

    Wait a minute... aren't you talking about the people that comes from more to the south? Why that description gives the scenary of some counties in the states of the western and north of Mexico?

    You are talking about one or maybe two cases, like I said above that some farmers have experienced bad cases with the workers. And don't forget, that "cancer" (tourism) keeps a country alive and wealthy, take that away and the wealth of one country changes dramatically if it doesn't have many natural ressources. ;)

    I'm not Canadian, got nothing to do with them neither, but I live here, I like it and to me it is one of the better, safer and more stable nations to live in today.

    mrb

    Not our case, really. Sometimes I think that tourism overvalued.

    And then there is the weather.

    It has been snowing in the West for a few days now, but this one is going to be a real 'female dog' on the East.

    Certainly, one of the another things of Canada is its weather. Cold, technically. I like cold weather. Also, that storm, wow, I would like to be there (how if I've never been in a hurricane :lol: ).

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    The official motto of Canada is "Peace, Order and Good Government". Generally we achieve the first two, but the last is usually moot.

    I think 'not terrible Government' is about the best we can hope for... anywhere.

    Share this post


    Link to post
    Share on other sites

    Create an account or sign in to comment

    You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

    Create an Account  

    Sign up to join our friendly community. It's easy!  

    Register a New Account

    Sign In  

    Already have an account? Sign in here.

    Sign In Now

    Sign in to follow this  

    • Recently Browsing   0 members

      No registered users viewing this page.

    ×

    Help Keep Simtropolis Online, Open & Free!

    stexcollection-header.png

    Would you be able to help us catch up after a bit of a shortfall?

    We had a small shortfall last month. Your donation today would help us catch up for this month.

    Make a Donation, Get a Gift!

    We need to continue to raise enough money each month to pay for expenses which includes hardware, bandwidth, software licenses, support licenses and other necessary 3rd party costs.

    By way of a "Thank You" gift, we'd like to send you our STEX Collector's DVD. It's some of the best buildings, lots, maps and mods collected for you over the years. Check out the STEX Collections for more info.

    Each donation helps keep Simtropolis online, open and free!

    Thank you for reading and enjoy the site!

    More About STEX Collections