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SimCity: Regions

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SimCity2013's biggest possible region:

* Maximum tiles in region: 16

* One and only available tile size: 2048m x 2048m

* Maximum area: 16*2^2 = 64 sq. km.

How do you figure that the largest region contains 16 tiles?

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as for now, city tiles arent tiled throughout the region. Therefore that would possibly be the smallest region area with 16 city tiles within it. I would guess a region to be ~18km x 18km where 64km^ is develop able and 260km^ is not

According to this: http://forum.ea.com/eaforum/posts/list/9165065.page I'm just about right on the money except for considering the areas for building great works.

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How do you figure that the largest region contains 16 tiles?

From the Origin page: "Multiplayer: 1-16 Online Only". I do recall seeing that the 16-player option was one city per person, but I can't remember quite where that was.

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SimCity2013's biggest possible region:

* Maximum tiles in region: 16

* One and only available tile size: 2048m x 2048m

* Maximum area: 16*2^2 = 64 sq. km.

That's assuming all the lots are adjacent, with no gaps in between. Also, you need space for the Great Works. There was a recent image showing region view with 16 cities and several Great Work sites, so you're talking a lot bigger (you just can't build on all of it unfortunately)

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Official: There is a LIMIT to the maximum number of cities/regions you can play

marcomsousa 69 points 12 hours ago

Since this is online, will there be a limit in the number of regions/cities that I can play?

[–]MaxisKip 87 points 11 hours ago

Yes, we had to put a cap here. We learned a lot on Spore about this. You'll have plenty of save slots, which will allow you to create and manage many regions and cities. We haven't locked the number yet, but what I can say is that they are bound to regions. So if you created a 16 city region, you could play all 16 cities and that would be one save slot.

[–]marcomsousa 7 points 11 hours ago

You are telling me that there will be different region sizes.

Can I choose the number of cities in a new region?

The max number of cities for a region is 16?

[–]MaxisKip 12 points 11 hours ago

We've created different region maps of different sizes. We have smaller maps that are only 2-3 cities, for a shorter more intimate experience. And larger ones, like our 16 City Regions for something a little more epic. You'll have plenty of choices on how to play.

http://www.reddit.co...rom_maxis_amaa/

What are your thoughts on this?

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What are your thoughts on this?

My thoughts on this are not FCC compliant.

If a city in SC2013 really is the size of a medium SC4 tile as reported, then it is ~4 km^2. A 16 city region would thus be about 64 km^2 of total interconnected (however rudimentary) playing space. And we're given to understand in the reddit that those connections are spaced out, so the cities within a region do not form a closely connected overhead like we can do in SC4. AND there's a hard cap on the number of regions?

Drunkapple is making maps over 100km on a side; that's over 10,000 km^2. And those maps are easily playable with a 64bit OS and 4gigs of ram (my 5 year old bargain box, not even a good desktop pc).

Some basic math: 64 km^2 / 10,000 km^2 = 0.64%. That's right, a map from sc2013 has less than 1% the playable area of one of drunkapple's large maps on a 10 year old game?

Please. Moving on.

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Non-shocker. As long as I can play all cities in my region I don't really care how many regions you can have saved at any one time, although I'm positive Maxis will make the cap a fair one.

Also @blunder: Would you have been able to run 100km x 100km maps on the avarage machine back when SC4 first came out? I think we might be able to get larger regions in SC2013 sometime in the future, but I don't think it'll ever be on such a scale.

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Non-shocker. As long as I can play all cities in my region I don't really care how many regions you can have saved at any one time, although I'm positive Maxis will make the cap a fair one.

Also @blunder: Would you have been able to run 100km x 100km maps on the avarage machine back when SC4 first came out? I think we might be able to get larger regions in SC2013 sometime in the future, but I don't think it'll ever be on such a scale.

1. I would like to have 10 large regions since that will come close to 5 Cities XL cities.

2. Yes, those are 100x100km region maps. That is unless there is a mod that allows for larger city tiles. Pretty much any computer can load large regions except for bare bones minimum requirement computers for SimCity 4.

3. My opinion: I will not purchase this game for more than $40 before tax.

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As if we didn't expect that one. This is all done to save SERVER traffic.

So we don't want online, but we get it, even better, we have to swallow all off it's limitation as I don't see any more freedom that we get from being online all the time (except the priviledge to have our PC's scanned by EA ofcourse).

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Also @blunder: Would you have been able to run 100km x 100km maps on the avarage machine back when SC4 first came out? I think we might be able to get larger regions in SC2013 sometime in the future, but I don't think it'll ever be on such a scale.

At release? No, but it would have still greatly surpassed the sc2013 region size. Heck, the vanilla timbuktu region has more area than a 16-city sc2013 'region'. Using the game's rendering system (not terraformer or mapper) back when i had 2 gigs of ram, the largest region i could render was about 52km x 52km. BUT i was too stupid to render using an empty plugin folder, so i don't know what the initial limit would have been. Also the limiting factor on map size has always been memory availible to the program. The only change in technology that has effected maximum map size is the advent of a 64-bit OS and applying a 4-gig patch to simcity.exe (boosting the virtual memory useable by the application from 2 gigs to 4 gigs). Everything else has been a matter of how much ram can you plug in.

EA/Maxis said region size was limited by the need to simulate everything, down to children playing in the backyard, which is supposed to be some jolly good easter egg of telling us we're doing a competent job of mayorship or sumsuch. Choosing the technical limitation that constrains the game as simulating little sprites is a little ridiculous when this could be so very much more.

People posted while i was typing. :D

As if we didn't expect that one. This is all done to save SERVER traffic.

This, better than any technobabble i spout, hits the nail squarely on the head. :party:

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Non-shocker. As long as I can play all cities in my region I don't really care how many regions you can have saved at any one time, although I'm positive Maxis will make the cap a fair one.

Also @blunder: Would you have been able to run 100km x 100km maps on the average machine back when SC4 first came out?

The default MAXIS Fairview Region is already near the maximum size by SimCity (2013) standards. (8km x 8km or 64km2). That does not even include all that wasted space between the municipios ... err... "cities".

This is the problem when you build the game around the limitations of your game engine. Instead the engine should be built around the game.

If the small regions sizes weren't bad enough, there is also a max save limit.

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This is the problem when you build the game around the limitations of your game engine. Instead the engine should be built around the game.

The Glassbox engine is tailor made for this game though. This game started with the idea that Maxis wanted to be able to simulate everything that was going on in the city and the agent based glassbox was built for exactly that purpose.

*snip*

Very insightful and well said. While I'm on the opposing side of your playstyle, I can't help but approach the new game with a bit of caution. Maxis is moving in such a radical direction that I have almost no frame of reference to compare this to.

That said, I'd say that maxis is trying to make sticking around in your cities as interesting as possible now that sustainability is a problem players have to deal with. Even if you filled the borders of one tile with a mix of buildings that made your city perfectly balanced and profitable, it likely won't stay that way for long due to the depletion of resources and/or changes is the global economy. This is where I think the longevity of the new game is going to come from. The constant balancing and adjusting of not just one city, but an entire region's worth of cities over time in relation to each other as well as the economy. When I think about it this way, 16 developed cities could be pretty difficult to keep track of.

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This is the problem when you build the game around the limitations of your game engine. Instead the engine should be built around the game.

The Glassbox engine is tailor made for this game though. This game started with the idea that Maxis wanted to be able to simulate everything that was going on in the city and the agent based glassbox was built for exactly that purpose.

True. That is where Maxis gets it so wrong. If the default MAXIS "Fairview" Region in SimCity 4 is already considered large by SimCity (2013) standards, why bother with all these mini simulations if you are going to put so many wasteful restrictions in the game? The only reason why Maxis will do something ridiculous like putting a save limit on the game is because of the servers and their limitations.

marcomsousa 69 points 12 hours ago

Since this is online, will there be a limit in the number of regions/cities that I can play?

[–]MaxisKip 87 points 11 hours ago

Yes, we had to put a cap here. We learned a lot on Spore about this. You'll have plenty of save slots, which will allow you to create and manage many regions and cities. We haven't locked the number yet, but what I can say is that they are bound to regions. So if you created a 16 city region, you could play all 16 cities and that would be one save slot.

I applaud Kip for being honest with his answer.

But restricting putting a cap to save slots for your regions/cities is a HUGE design flaw. If this is the real cost of "always-online" then there really is no point to making the game "always-online". Can anyone even imagine playing Sim City 4 with a cap on how many regions or cities you can have?

Small regions + small cities + empty unused space between cities + limited number of regions + limited number of cities + must have internet connection to save = Inevitably Short Lifespan.

Why will I spend $50 - $80 for something that will have such a short lifespan?

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I must agree. Those restrictions are more restrictions. I want to have the freedom to create my city my way!

I want a region larger than that of Greater New York, but no, the total developable area had to be one-tenth of the land area of Toronto proper. I am not satisfied.

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I believe they said that the region size limitation is mostly a RAM (in computer) memory issue, not a save game size issue or a cpu issue. In SC2013 only one city is active at a time like in SC4, however unlike SC4 the entire region remains loaded and visible. Based on the Steam Hardware survay (which I assume is biased to more "hard core" gamers) about 55% of steam gamers have 2-4 gigs of ram. Sc2013 puts the minimum requirements at 4 GB which, even in todays market, is a heafty requirement.

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As I said before, I'm not surprised.

It's also worth noting that the total area of a region in SimCity is not much larger than that of an individual city in CXL.

The fact of the matter is that all regions of all sizes are smaller than individual Cities XL cites. Does the Glass Box make up for the limitations? That is up to you to decide.

--Ocram

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The Glassbox is rather ambitious for today's technology, at least if they want to cater to those with lower-end computers, but then again, the same could be said for CXL. I'd personally be fine with previous installments' statistical simulations. At least we'd get bigger maps.

As it is now, it is simply impossible to create a city with this game. Is the Glassbox worth that? Some would say yes, but I don't think so.

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Is it is now, it is simply impossible to create a city with this game. Is the Glassbox worth that? Some would say yes, but I don't think so.

I say yes because it is the only factor that separates Simcity from CitiesXL. I even think with a Simcity 4 statistical simulator you will still end up with a smaller city than CitiesXL.

So, was no one happy with SC4 unless you played the largest tile?

I was wondering about that too.

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