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Why do people like those European wall-to-wall buildings so much?

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The W2W architecture is present all over europe, not only in france but everywhere in europe, very popular in France, but only since  Haussmann in the 1800's and in Holland, because of the country laws

And the "why?" you say is simply because people want to build decent european cities, and a classical and decent european city without W2W buildings is unconcievable.

And well if you're getting annoyed then there you go, you will not change the world and history of architecture, unless you are the 21st century Corbusier.....

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Some people are European you know?  One or two are even Parisian.  Just because Maxis didn't make Parisian buildings when they built the game doesn't mean people aren't allowed to use the excellent European buildings created by users.  

There are no rules to making a great CJ.  You can make them following what ever architectural style you want!  If you don't like someone's CJ because they use a different architectural style to you then just ignore it! 

Long live Europe!

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Why do I like them? Because it's what I see day after day when I walk outside my home. Virtually every city and town in Europe has buildings built in an W2W fashion (the building where I live is a good example of this) but Maxis concieved SC4 with a quite North American-centrist mentality (no offense, but that's the truth). This is why nearly all W2W buildings you see out there are custom. If you don't like them... well, that's easy; don't follow European-styled CJs...

EDIT: well, psander5 has said the same than me, but we've been writing at the same time...

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lol well, simple question, simple answer: as architecture is not entirely the same on the planet and there are a lot of cities that are naturally grown over centuries- and in a lot of cases- over a thousand years old (and more- really!), we have these wall to wall buildings 4.gif not conforming to the typical grid new cities tend to be built on. Well, and speaking as an Austrian (European) I really like this building style, and from my experience it is very charming especially for non-Europeans 2.gif

But, hey, it is that easy as 'psander5' and 'TekindusT' have already pointed out: just do NOT click the European tileset in game and avoid CJs that seem to be European-influenced.. Easy, isn't it?

Thus, this should really save you a lot of nerves and energy... maybe you are the only one who has been suffering from this problem 2.gif

If you ever change your mind: just get yourself a ticket to Europe, but make sure that you do not do whole of it within one week 2.gif

Take care,

lucky7

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Thanks to all for keeping this "level-headed" and on topic. Please remember, as others have mentioned, that there are players from a variety of backgrounds who use sites such as Simtropolis and wish to contribute based on their own experiences - all are welcome.

Thanks again.

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that's a question I wonder about almost every day.

I don't like w2w at all, and even less like the parisian style of w2w with like 5 6 7 or more floors. of course paris wouldn't be paris without its distiguished architecture, but does that mean I have to like it?

or even worse, do I have to like it because any dislike might hurt the feelings of those who like it or even live in it? I don't think so.

Also, the area where I live is literally cluttered with semi-detached remnants of when mining&steel-driven nation build housings for its workers at a time when semi-detached building was a pip and also cheap enough to be within the financial perspective of the planned inhabitants, miners, steelworkers and the likes. And I personally don't like this particular architecture at all.

Yes I am no fan of the central european architecture as such, especially historic european buildings (in terms of building style; especially those build between the Renaissance and say the late 60ies or 70ies) and even more any form off w2w.

Although I must admit that I like the classic scandinavian architecture as well as ancient european (as in roman) architecture as well as most modern single family homes as long as they're stand-alone.

That's why I ask myself the same question like pipcard. And as I totally love the US american building style, especially the south west (when it comes to family homes) I find it, somtimes at least, sad that people are focusing so much on european/asian buildings (but that's a matter of vanilla game content; the batters do what's not available)

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W2W system is very common in Europe and of course in Hellas (Greece). Especially in a seismic country like Hellas, W2W system prevent collapsing of too much buildings, making the apartment buildings more safe. As about Simcity, W2W isn't bad, but it's not my playing style too. I also prefer the Maxis-North American system, but some row houses will make the city looks more interesting. Just my opinion 1.gif

And remember: Don't like it? Don't use it 2.gif

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Originally posted by: GMT

That's why I ask myself the same question like pipcard. And as I totally love the US american building style, especially the south west (when it comes to family homes) I find it, somtimes at least, sad that people are focusing so much on european/asian buildings (but that's a matter of vanilla game content; the batters do what's not available)quote>

Simple, many BATters are European, you get European buildings, why should i for instance, from Norway make American buildings, when i find European buildings to be much more fitting to my playing style? It's the same with stadiums, why are there more football( soccer) stadiums on the STEX than any other sport? Answer: It's the world's largest sport.

if you want more American BATs, you need more BATters from America, because you most likely won't get any from non-Americans since we prefer to make local buildings, as well as anything more relevant to our continent.

And umm... you DO realise you have W2W buildings in North America too?

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Originally posted by: TowerDude

The W2W architecture is present all over europe, not only in france but everywhere in europe, very popular in France, but only since  Haussmann in the 1800's and in Holland, because of the country laws

And the "why?" you say is simply because people want to build decent european cities, and a classical and decent european city without W2W buildings is unconcievable.

And well if you're getting annoyed then there you go, you will not change the world and history of architecture, unless you are the 21st century Corbusier.....

quote>

AMEN TO THAT!!!


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Originally posted by: madhatter106

Some people like horseradish.

Some people don't like horseradish.

'nuff said.quote>

True, the point is though; don't try and desuade people from liking horseradish just because you don't 9.gif

_______

Sorry, I didn't realise that ": |" would make such an angry looking smiley in the forum!  I wasn't that upset 4.gif

Anyway...

For Europeans (and I guess Asians, Africans and Middle Easterners), cities only look right when they have lots of of w2w developments, particularly in the central core.  America (+Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc) has the luxury of space and forward planning, where the much older European cities evolved out of the landscape, often using up limited buildable space.  We also have a bit of a complicated history of conflict, meaning that most of our cities were walled in for long periods of time.  That meant that as the populations grew, we had to build our homes and buildings right up against each other if we wanted to live within the safety of the walls.  I guess that's why we like our w2w buildings.  

Look further out though into the post industrial suburbs and you'll see that we do like our detatchment too now that the fighting has stopped.  It's very rare these days to see new terraced estates being built on the edges of town.  

Personally when I play the game I like to use w2w ploppable commercials in my town centres, but I'm too lazy to mess about with w2w residentials.  I can see how pure game players or 'growers' might not like w2w's at all.  The game isn't really built to handle natural w2w zoned development.  In the wonderful world of CJ's however, we wall-to-wallers can come out and play, since we can cheat and manipulate everything to our archaic European desires!  I admire those CJ's that use lots of w2w buildings... because it's not as easy as the North American method to make them look realistic. 

Having said all this I'm not anti-American-cities either.  I like to see gridded cities where every building has at least four walls... even though you could get half a dozen good sized houses on one wasteful north American lot 3.gif

Everyone should be invited to the SC4 party! 39.gif

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For Europeans (and I guess Asians, Africans and Middle Easterners), cities only look right when they have lots of of w2w developments, particularly in the central core.  America (+Canada, Australia, New Zealand etc) has the luxury of space and forward planning, where the much older European cities evolved out of the landscape, often using up limited buildable space.  We also have a bit of a complicated history of conflict, meaning that most of our cities were walled in for long periods of time.  That meant that as the populations grew, we had to build our homes and buildings right up against each other if we wanted to live within the safety of the walls.  I guess that's why we like our w2w buildings.quote>

I would go further on this reasoning. W2W isn't only present in major city centers as an effect of being walled for hundreds of years; or because for lack of space. Watch at this pic:

fptp.jpg

This pic is an Street View from my hometown; and this neighbourhood was built around the 1950s-1960s far from the city center; and still W2W is present everywhere in this district and everywhere in my hometown. On the time this neighbourhood was built, the way people built their homes was quite like SC4 sims build them: they bought an empty lot and simply built their homes.

But as we are discussing here, Maxis designed only quite a few W2W buildings (not to talk about the Haussmann, central European or Mediterranean styles); and some players, like me, have been missing them. This is why people creates them.

Anyways, this isn't a topic to be "pro-" or "anti-". We play how we like, don't we?

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In many places in the world land is so expensive that you are allowed to build out to the property line.  Unlike us, in North America, they really don't have setback rules.

I find some European cities charming, and some areas of Paris fascinating.  The city in Europe I know best is Bordeaux where I stayed for a couple of weeks.  It is a grand place, and if you get a chance to visit, do.  If you are there on your own, the best introduction to the wine country is through the Syndicat d'Initiatif (tourist bureau).  When I was there, you could take a different tour each week day which includes, as they said "deux chais et un rocher", that is two wineries and one museum or great house.  It is a quick way to sample the vintages at 10 great wine makers.  The tours I took included Lurs Salices (the home of Chateau Y'quem}, Chateau Mouton Rothschild, and several others of surprising obscurity considering the quality of their products.  I also managed to find some beautiful little places like St. Julien, Arcachon, Angoulème and Cognac.  All featured W2W layouts, but who can argue with red roofs, white walls, green fields and golden cows.  The public buildings down there are faced in a golden-yellow sandstone by ordinance.

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When I said wall-to-wall, I meant stuff that looks like this (the one that looks early 20th century, 19th, or even earlier than that):

renduberg2.png

(from "The Commonwealth of Frenris" by Weecaeks)

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I believe it is true that people like what their home city/land has. Pipcard, one could assume that you are American purely based on your building preference. Glenni is European based on his preference and BATs.

But that doesn't mean that one DOESN'T like the alternative style. And there are also substyles as well. For example, I'm not too fond of the Parisian style, but throw me something English or German and I will be drooling. The same goes for skyscrapers. I'm not a fan of New-York style concrete highrises, but I love ones with a more subtle midrisy feel.

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Y'know, we can just like our own style of buildings and move on with it. I like mint chocolate chip ice cream, you may not. Doesn't make any difference. I'll keep eating it as my favorite regardless of what your opinion is. Cause its mine 9.gif *noms*

(For those of you unable to understand metaphors, here's the translation: Just cause you don't like a certain style doesn't mean another person doesn't. They are free to use that style regardless of what you think)

[This seems to be heading towards a cyclic discussion... and remember, be nice]

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Let's put it this way, i don't very much like Parisian Hausmanian buildings, but i do like the more German, Polish, Swedish and Norwegian type W2W buildings.

They're down to earth, some are grand. Some are more of simple workers type housing either way they're normal here, even in my town of a mere 30 000 people we have W2W buildings (See Smedasundet on STEX)

But the point is, it's not just a European thing, you do have old and indeed historic buildings in the US of 6 floors and less in a wall to wall setting, so i don't really see all the ignorance portrayed here, saying it's only a European thing.

Also, that picture, i hate to break it to you but most of those are from Warsaw POLAND, and Vienna, AUSTRIA and not Paris FRANCE. I'd suggest doing some research before you label them as French....

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Originally posted by: Pipcard

Okay, the problem is not wall-to-wall, I actually just don't like buildings that look like they're from the 19th century.quote>

You do know that in some parts of the world people still live in old buildings?   Not every city has only recently popped out of the ground or been completely rebuilt.  I'm fairly certain the building a new city or completely rebuilding cities every twenty or forty years would be a bit too expensive.  

And since these older buildings exist in real life, people decided to bring them into SC4 to mimic those older districts, ergo answering your question!

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Originally posted by: Glenni

And umm... you DO realise you have W2W buildings in North America too?

quote>

but not to this enormous extent like in europe. if you go into towns, yeah there's a helluvalot of them, just take the NYC metro, or any other metro, or older central areas. San Fran is about as famous for it's distinguishable w2w architechture as London, just to name examples. There're more than enough w2w buildings (and I sort of like them better than, say, Paris, Barcelona, Berlin...) but if you go into suburbs or even better, suburban sprawl areas, w2w becomes a pretty much nonexisting sight except for some commercial areas or central suburban areas, unlike in many european areas where even in the suburban areas to the very city limits, you can find many row houses or at least semidetached single family homes. Try to find newly build w2w suburban homes in the US, and do it in Europe. I've came around quite a lot in the US southwest (Socal, entire AZ, Vegas area) and I can't think of any other w2w buildings in suburban areas than commercial used buildings. Contrary to more urban areas, like I said.

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I am from Calgary with a very North American style of building and I dislike most of it. Right now I live out in one of the clone housing suburban neighbourhoods famous for lost people and sprawl which I find very ugly. The downtown core is not very impressive as most of the buildings are squared. What I do like about it is the park system which has paths going all over the place and a few major natural parks that find deer, coyotes and the occasional bear coming out of them (we even had a black bear walk into the ER waiting room at one of the big hospitals a few years back); In the downtown I like two of the buildings that make up Banker's Hall but find it overall severly lacking in imagination and feel it needs some life breathed into it which is now happening slowly but lots of citizens are saying that the new buildings are too fancy and want to see more conservative architecture.

But whatever...is the point...an opinion of where I live

I am undecided on which is my favourite city in the world but I feel that it is either Edinburgh or Berlin. I love being in Edinburgh, the architecture is stunning like classic London and the entire gothic era had a baby. I love Berlin as far as architecture goes because it has old buildings, new buildings and every improvisation of architecture it can seem to handle.

I really want to spend time in Asia to see everything from the ancient right up to the overwhelming neon glows.

I think the opinions about architecture comes down to the culture reflected in it and the meaning it holds to you. Some people may see the romanticized culture of Europe pouring out of the architecture while some may see it as old; some people may see the culture of gleaming economic progress in North American architecture and some may see it as sacrificing beauty and pleasure.

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